Hey Guys! For anyone who is interested...if you do a search for Dorlastan Spandex thread on eBay you will find that a user named Sarah is selling huge spools of it. This stuff is identical to the stuff that you get from the dealers. If you were to buy one sp**l of this t****d you would have enough to start your own IE shop. Thousands of yards. These sp**ls are 6 inches in diameter! check out the pictures. There aren't many of them so if you are an IE user it would be wise to snatch one up from this lady. I did. Did I mention that one spool only costs $6?! That is a fraction of the cost of what you get from some dealers and you get about a thousand times more of the stuff for it. This IE comes pretty thick and can be stripped down to more thinner strands. So in addition to the rediculous length...multiply that by 3 or 4 and now you have an idea of how much IE we are talking about. It of course must be colored like all other elastic threads.


Posted: Oct 13, 2004 11:40pm
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I should also mention that making loops is very easy and should not cost you anything. PM me if you want a surefire method of tying them with no "equipment."
This knowledge combined with the amount of IE you would get from this source will have you moving stuff for the rest of your life.

WOW!! McScratchy, Thank you so much for the GOLD MINE!
Gerard

McDcratchy,

Thanks for the info. Very much appreciated. I copied the link over to an email to myself for safekeeping.

Thanks again.

Mike

In Michael Ammar's series on IT, he talks about denier and mentions that "some threads can be stripped down to 5 denier although 10-20 denier may be sufficinet for most uses."

I just went online to eBay and checked out this thread. The seller sent me an email advising that the thickness is 0040 denier and is SINGLE strand and she only has it available in white. Being single strand, is this 0040 denier "thin" enough to be invisible under normal IT conditions?

The obvious question is what does "0040" signify? is this "40 denier"? Or, is it "Four Thousanths of one denier"? I don't know the answer.

Doing a Google search, I found the following:

"denier
Unit used in measuring the fineness of yarns, equal to the mass in grams of 9,000 metres of yarn. Thus 9,000 metres of 15 denier nylon, used in nylon stockings, weighs 15 g/0.5 oz, and in this case the thickness of thread would be 0.00425 mm/0.0017 in. The term is derived from the French silk industry; the denier was an old French silver coin."

This obviously does not answer the question as to whether or not the 0.00425mm is the 0040 denier that this thread is listed as.

And, while Michael Ammar says anything between 10 & 20 denier is sufficient for most purposes, the picture on eBay showing this single thread (contrasted against a tape measure in bright light) gives me pause as to whether or not this particular thread is either too thick or too visible for our intended magic applications.

Does any magician here on the Café know the answer to this denier question (i.e. what does "0040 denier" mean) and, assuming that 0.00425mm equates with 0040 denier, whether or not the 15 denier would be suitable for our purposes? I'm going to go ahead and buy a roll of the thread since the eBay auction ends within hours. I'll report back as to my findings.

Thanks for the info.

Mike

P.S. In watching the Ammar DVD, it seemed to me that when Ammar was stripping out the Lycra thread from the black panty hose, the non-elastic thread was black but the lycra being stripped out appeared white. Is lycra, in fact, only manufactured in white?

McScratchy:

What is "IE"? Do you mean "IT"?

Hello all,
IE is Invisible Elastic. IT is invisible thread. Both are thread however. I guess I should have labeled it IET....but I have always referred to it as invisible elastic.

Turk about your questions. I have been working with this thread for several days now. I can assure you that the thread is not really white. It is more of a translucent quality. In other words it is just like the thread you get from any dealer before it has been colored or dyed. It appears white because there is so much of it bundled together that it loses it translucent appearance. I seem to remember having a pair of socks that contained lycra filaments. One of them just happened to be poking out of my sock so I just pulled it out to inspect it. It was of a grayish brown color and I was able to strip it down. It behaved in the same way that this thread does but I do not know where to get such a thread. You would have to walk into a factory somewhere to find something so specific. Maybe someone else on the Café' has access to one...hehehehe.

This thread is 40 denier (what does that mean exactly? I am not sure but I don't really care because it is working for me and it will work for you too).
What the seller doesn't even know is that this thread can be split down into 3-5 more strands. When you first get it, it appears to be a monofilament. However, thanks to the nature of this particular micro-polymer chain...the thread can be split and each of the smaller strands will still have the same structural stability on a smaller scale. Stripping this thread is not like striping IT.

For any who have purchased this thread I will PM you with some nice detailed instructions on how to strip and tie and die your own loops. Just PM me and I will shoot one right back at you.

I do not own the Ammar thread series so I don't know much about his techniques. All I can say is that I strip the thread down until it is thin enough...but not too thin as I want it to be maybe a one notch stronger than necessary. I just like to have that security when I perform. You could even make loops of different thickness and strength. One for when your spectators are really, really close or if you are working in bad light and one for normal situations.

Lycra, Spandex, and Dorlastan are all the same substance...these are just the various trade names for it. The thread in question is Dorlastan...which I believe is manufactured in Germany. The loops that I have made with this thread are more reliable than any others that I have used. When I perform I always start with a fresh new one of course and I have never had a breakage in performance. I might go home after that and practice or play around with the one I just used until it breaks, but at least I know that I will rarely and maybe never have a breakage in performance...especially now that I have control over the strength of the thread I am using. I worked at a party last night and I did 3 different effects using the same loop...and each of these effects I probably did 5 or 6 times each in the course of the night. Not one broken loop.

I also love the fact that I can make loops of any size. I made one big enough to go around my chest the other day. I of course have to store in on a big card board piece about 8" x 10" but I think that has great potential. Also...everyone who works with elastic thread should read up on Dan Harlan's "The Harlan Hook-Up". This is different from loops and will expand your range of effects using IET. I am not sure where this is published. You might have to ask around or just ask Mr. Harlan himself.

All I can say is that I am glad I never have to strip thread out of stockings. Now that we have this and wooly nylon...things are much easier.

I hope this post has been somewhat informative.

-Gared Crawford (I love the Coolspot!)

This thread is GREAT! Dorlastan is considered a premium brand of Spandex. The denier of the COMBINED strand is 40 denier (the average human hair is about 50 denier) However, this thread breaks down into multiple threads of (by my best estimate) 8-12 denier each (you can break it down into probably 3-5 threads each as Gared has stated...do the math!) As far as coloring, it can be dyed or zebra striped using the normal methods, according to how close you are working with it and your lighting/background..For 6 bucks a spool, it's well worth checking out! Thanks Gared for the awesome hookup on a great deal!

I have been splitting the same strand of thread for about a week now and I must have hundreds of feet of the thinner threads by now. I have been winding it onto some empty spools I had lying around. So far I have only been able to break it down into 3 strands. Has anyone else been able to get more? Just curious.

-Gared C.

Hiya, Magi:

Just bought one -- I'll let you know about it later.

Leland

Great find, just jealous that I can't get it over here!

Tony

Okay, it just arrived in the mail today. McScratchy is right and then some...this stuff is just too good to be true. Looks to me like the initial thread breaks down into three component strands -- 'course, it could be my eyesight, too.

Leland

Yeah, that sounds about right. I have only been able to get 3 strands as well. I guess that means that each strand is about 13.33333 denier. I wonder if there is a way to break it down further. Though I can't see a reason because it is plenty invisible.

I live in France and can't get it here;-(
May be someone can help people like me to find the same thread here

or may be buy it for me...

thanks

sincerely

I just ordered a spool, and I'm new to all this !
I've been toying with the loops that I got for free with an order from Penguinmagic, and a Sorcery ITR I recently got. I think IT and IE/IET are very cool aspects of magic to work in.
The loops are great, but I quickly saw the advantage in making your own.
Does anyone recommend a best learning source for homespun loops ? I was considering:
"Whos afraid of Invisible Thread" or "The Million Dollar Knot" for starters.
thanks.

Well this sounds way to good to be true , I see the ebay site and she has about seven of them.. I am going to buy it right now .. buy the way , does who use it are they strong? because the ones that penguin sent to me for free seem kinda weak?

Paisa, did you see this on ebay today? I just looked but couldn't find it. I searched; Dorlastan Spandex thread, Dorlastan and spandex thread with no luck. Could you post a link? Thanks.

Vandy

I sell the exact same item! I stock it in my L.A. Warehouse. Price is $6.25 per package plus shipping.

email me @ rudy@arkaytextiles.com

Rudy

Ok I'm a little upset , I think by bringing this up again they have all been bought up.. she had 7 last night..they have all been bought up . I was going to order one today but I guess I wated to long..

Hey all,

That auction came back up, but just ended Dec 5.
I tried to post to tell everyone who missed it the first time but the Café was undergoing it's database upgrade so I couldn't. I got a spool, and a good method for making loops, so I'll let you know how it works out.
Just go to eBay every once in a while, go to the category: Crafts > Sewing > Notions Supplies > Threads and do a search on "Dorlastan". Maybe it'll startup again soon if they get more supplies.

Hello!
Why wait for eBay to buy these! Email me for quick turnaround on 40 denier "Dorlastan" thread! $6.25 for 1 lb package shipping is a flat rate of $5.95.

rudy@arkaytextiles.com

Rudy Sanchez