Thanks for all the feedback guys!

Teevee,
Perhaps I can share some info.

The purpose of Tenyo Elite is to honor the original creations, it is not necessarily ment to change or try and improve them, and Tenyo is not looking for this either. Tenyo is involved every step of the way in how they are developed and represented as these tricks are their children.

There was a great deal amount of thought and R&D that went into making these, and remember these are not made by machines they are crafted by hand, and so we also wanted to keep them at an affordable price point as much as possible. So with that said, we had to build these out of wood without compromising the deceptiveness or the workings of the trick. Tenyo insists that an Elite version be just as deceptive as the original. And adding brass hardware, or changing the size, ring design or other things that would or could lessen the deceptiveness of the prop in any way was not allowed, and rightfully so as the main focus is still the magic and wonder the trick produces.

We experimented and built several prototypes with different ring design layouts.
We built some prototypes with a stone inlay ring design and also other inlays/engraving effects of different materials, but soon realized that adding many of these would only compromise the integrity and strength of the prop because there is very little material to work with, and we didn't want want these to be fragile. We want people to be able to rigorously perform with them as well as collect them. Not to mention the extra time and labor to do inlays or similar effects by hand were going to raise the cost of these by a substantial amount, and we again want to keep them affordable as much as possible. We could make one out of gold if we wanted, but it's no good if no one can afford it.

A huge amount of time and R&D also went into selecting the perfect wood, and several prototypes were built using several different types of woods. And they all respond differently. We chose the hard Canadian exotic sugar maple, not only because it is a high end wood but because of its color, strength, the finish it provides, and workability during the crafting process. We wanted a wood that was light in color so a printing of a dark ring design would contrast well, and a wood that would showcase the grain of the material beautifully. We also chose this wood because of how incredibly strong it is and the workability it offers so that the intricate cuts and finishing can be done beautifully and efficiently, so that the price again remains reasonable and the prop delivers strength and integrity so that it can stand up to real life performing.

Anyway, I've probably bored the heck out of everyone now, but just wanted to shed some light on the subject.

P.

Mmmmmmmm Canadian exotic sugar Maple.
You are making me hungry for pancakes Pete!

Thanks for the details Peter, not boring in the least.

I am sure that I cannot fathom the amount of work involved and I am not trying to lessen your efforts at all. Clearly there is a love and respect for Tenyo and I respect and admire that.

What you say about material thickness, fragility and costs makes perfect sense. My only question is if they end up being so close to the originals that they do not separate themselves from the originals enough?

Zig Zag Cig was never a favorite of mine so that is likely behind my initial reaction to the news. I really do wish you great success and have a feeling that this will feel more impressive and different from the original once in hand; pictures probably do not do it justice.

Maybe because the original is already a light wood color I'm being thrown. I look forward to your future releases when perhaps a brightly colored more toy like effect will be upgraded with rich woods etc.

Good luck and nice work.

Wow, congrats guys! This looks amazing and hard to believe you were able to make it in maple wood. Order is placed.
Thanks guys for sticking with this and releasing another great Elite item. Cheers,

John

Congrats Peter as well as the rest of you involved. Would have never guessed this is the effect you chose.

I think it looks great and my order is in!

My only drawback is this is a very popular trick that has been around a long time with many copies running around in inexpensive magic sets. Because of this I just don't think you are going to fool a lot of people with this. I don't mind that though because it was this trick that got me interested in magic in the first place and I bet a lot of people will feel the same way. It's an iconic effect in my opinion, so now having it offered in a collectible fashion made out of wood is a no brainer for me even though every kid may know how it works.

Charlie

Hello all:

Thank you for the continued feedback, questions, support, and of course your orders! We are nearly 50% sold out of our first run----and it's been just 24 hours!

Teevtee I understand your concern regarding whether or not our Tenyo Elite edition of the trick will separate itself from the original enough. However let me reassure you that once you hold this in your hand, you will see that the separation is in fact so clear. The Tenyo original is brilliant in design, look, and working. It is diabolical, and a favorite of so many magicians----in fact, it was the first trick that Peter Loughran bought when he was a kid. The issue that many performing and amateur magicians had is that it is plastic, and may not look very professional if you pull it out to perform in front of a paying crowd (close-up, restaurant magic, etc.). What we did was take the exact same workings, design, look and feel, and despite the doubts of many who understand the process of plastic molding, successfully turned it into a prop that amateur and professional magicians will not even hesitate to do in front of their paying audiences. So I truly believe that because of this, the separation between the amazing Tenyo original and our Elite version is very distinct. And yes you are correct TeevTee---the photos/videos do not do it justice.

ChasVH, I also understand your concern regarding it being popular with some copies out there as well. But I will tell you that I have shown this prototype to dozens of my friends and colleagues. Some are magicians, and some are not. Some have had kids with magic sets, and some have not. Everyone who saw it (including those few who are familiar with the workings) were just blown away by the look and beauty of the prop, and also by just how cool an illusion is created when you perform it. Just like any trick, there will always be some who know how it is done (because of exposure on a TV show, or they have seen it in a magic set, etc.). So while this trick got many interested in magic (like yourself and Peter Loughran), there are some that know the secret but the VAST majority of laypeople who you would perform this for will have no idea how it is done and love the trick! By the way, thank you for your order (and yours too J M Talbot)!

Best regards,

Jason

Hey Guys,

Thanks for all the orders, we are approaching 75% sold out of the first run in just 2 days! So thank you all so much for the support! So if you want one of these be sure to act fast before they are sold out.

The zig zag cig was one of the first magic tricks I bought when I visited my first magic shop in Toronto when I was just a little boy over 30 years ago(Browser's Den of Magic). I remember being completely fooled by it, and on the way home in my parents car, I sat in the back seat just zigging and zagging the little styrofoam cig that came with the trick, not really knowing the inner workings, just that it looked so convicing and real! It got me hooked on magic! So releasing this trick in an Elite form has special meaning to me.

We met Hiroshi Kondo the inventor of this and many Tenyo Tricks and he is also the current Vice President of Tenyo Japan, and he brought with him the original prototype he made at his house with peices of red and black plastic held together by tape, and he even performed the trick for us using the prototype he made back in the 1970's. How cool is that?! As that was a trick that further peaked my interest in magic when I was a little boy, you can imagine what a thrill this was for me(and all of us).

Below is a picture of us with the original Zig Zag Cig prototype!



From left to right: Hiroshi Kondo, Peter Loughran, Jason Palter, Steve Brooks.

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Super cool Peter... this is also one of my first magic tricks that "hooked" me as well, especially onto cool mechanical magic.
Congrats again to you all.

Charlie

Hey Peter, the only question I have is will it hold up as a worker.

Best

Hey Steve, Peter has commented a couple of times that the piece is durable... looks like they designed it for the collector and the worker...

"We also chose this wood because of how incredibly strong it is and the workability it offers so that the intricate cuts and finishing can be done beautifully and efficiently, so that the price again remains reasonable and the prop delivers strength and integrity so that it can stand up to real life performing."

Hello all:

Steve Conner, that is a very good question. The purpose of our renditions of the Tenyo tricks is of course for collectors, but more to the point, they are meant to be PERFORMED! Our Zig Zag Cig is very solidly constructed and has been rigorously tested for repeat performances. However it still is a handcrafted trick made out of wood. So while you don't have to be overly delicate handling it, you should always remember not to be too rough with it, and handle it with a reasonable amount of care.

Thank you for the continued support, questions, and business!

Best regards,

Jason

OK OK OK it's a great item but ... a cigarette trick nowadays??? A very bad signal to our beloved children. OK OK OK you can use an other object to divide, but that's yet... less magic.
So, great item, but not for children's parties!

You guys keep mentioning "first run".
I know others have sort if asked but let me be more direct:

Is the intent to have multiple runs?
How many units are produced per run?
Is there a limit set to end production?

Obviously an item becomes more desirable as a collectable if it is limited.
It looks like you are emulating Magic Wagon a bit. Those items are typically limited to about 50.
If you produce an open endless series if runs that's great and some if us may decide to purchase later but we would like to know the situation.
Have you sold 6 and made 11 or have you sold 750 and made 1000 with 1000 more to come?

Obviously I am using extremes but because we keep seeing that you are "almost sold out" and that this is the "first run" I think it's fair to ask what that means exactly.

Thanks again.

Sorry about the typos with "i" instead of "o".
I always do that on my phone for some reason.

I do not think that it makes it any less magical for a straw, pencil or metal bar to be split in three pieces.
Matter of fact I think it is MORE magical as they are denser objects.
Not sure why you think that the cigarette is the purpose??
What if Tenyo released it as the Zig Zig Pencil and we performed it for years with a pencil?
Would it be less magical if we then switched to a cig?
Not trying to come down on you at all...I just don't get the thought process.

Chance

[quote]On 2014-01-02 18:58, saverle wrote:
OK OK OK it's a great item but ... a cigarette trick nowadays??? A very bad signal to our beloved children. OK OK OK you can use an other object to divide, but that's yet... less magic.
So, great item, but not for children's parties!
[/quote

I think the endless lines of people in colorado waiting to buy recreational marijuana would no doubt love to see the zig zag of a smoke.

Brilliant MagiChrisMitch!
There is the entire routine right there.

HA! OK..that was funny!
Sort of a magical way to share the last doobage

I think some people prefer the idea if a cigarette because in theory it COULD be cut into three pieces.
In other words the trick is the restoration not the cutting. It is obviously not possible to use this device to cut a metal bar in thirds, therefore the heat is placed on a switch before the actual effect even starts.

I always viewed The use of a cigarette specifically because it was soft and possibly able to be split.

I'd still love to hear about the plans for edition sizes and second or third runs. Not saying one is right or wrong but a collectible is quite different if there are 5,50,500 or 5000.
Reminds me of the joke about the old Ford LTD AKA the Ford Limited. Limited to what? however many they could sell apparently.

I see your point. Given that...I think a piece of Red Rope Licorice would put this right into the "Kidzone"
Not bad huh?
If I thought about it a bit more I am sure there are a few other candy types that would go over well for kids or adults.
Gettin outside the box