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The Magic Cafe Forum Index :: Nothing up my sleeve... :: My variation on the Retention Vanish (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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dduane
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Bridgewater, MA
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Nice, Flyswatter. I put a suggestion on your YouTube page. (Didn't want to trigger a discussion here on M.S.'s RV.)
nicolasmtg
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Nice one flyswater Smile

I think you should film a video on different situation maybe sitting just to compare Smile
--------Magician and director at NONTRICKS.COM--------
Bodgit
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Looks great.
CarpetShark
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I do not wish to start anything negative, but my guess is it's a rolling ROV. What do you guys think ? If I am out-of-line, please let me know.
Flyswatter
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Quote:
On 2013-09-16 15:56, CarpetShark wrote:
I do not wish to start anything negative, but my guess is it's a rolling ROV. What do you guys think ? If I am out-of-line, please let me know.



It is not a rolling ROV Smile
CarpetShark
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Fly, in that case, I am even more impressed! Could not see any movement from your RH fingers - which in my opinion is the key to a good RoV.

Awesome stuff Smile
fonda57
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What is a rolling RoV?
Lawrence O
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Quote:
On 2013-09-10 22:30, Mb217 wrote:
Looks good Fly. Smile

And all the other examples given here are worth their salt as well, as to the move. I personally haven't seen anyone use this particular move any better than Mickey Silver. He makes an effect, a routine in and of itself, out of mostly using this core move - admittedly at a very high level. And really, that's all it is..."a move," a ways to a mean, like a nail hammered to put 2 pieces of wood together, or a step amidst a flight of stairs. It goes by so fast (unless you're doing Mickey Silver level stuff and keep repeating it in various creative ways) Smile and is really aimed at one thing, that is making specs believe you have put the coin where it is not. The lasting imagery of it is so vivid, thanks to the science of this move, that it is hard to resist as absolutely true. With that, there are many ways to do it and most work whether they are well done or not, truth be told, because the greater part of what makes it work is in the spec's mind through his or her eyes. Get the basic mechanics right and away you go. Smile

So, we magicians physically put the coin into the hand and the mind of the spec does the rest because it flirts so effectively with our logic - everything just looks right. Smile The basic ROV taught in Bobo's is about how it works ("The Illusive Coin Vanish," I believe), no matter how you do it and within the context of using it to show a coin going into the other hand. It works in many ways but always for the same purpose really. I've learned to do it several ways over the years, but this basic way does the trick for me more so than not, especially if I'm not getting any more creative in using it.

Again, Mickey Silver is about the only one I've seen to any great degree, that has taken a single nail and built a whole house with it, as to this move. Your proficiency with it looks darn good. Nice to get such an important move down well like that. Good job and keep going! Smile


Interesting point of view, Marion. I share this analysis with a "but". Despite his perfect ROV, Micky is not using it alone and he introduces a "feint" as the classic magicians used to do. He performs his perfect take on the ROV and then proves that the coin is "indeed" in the left hand with a move he created where his right hand replaces the coin over the left fingers (without releasing it at the base of the left fingers) and steals the coin again as the left hand closes after the proof.

Thus it seems that the false transfer is the effect itself but the feint is as important as the false transfer since it does away with the spectators' mental rewinding where the reality of the transfer is questionned (if it's not here, it must be in the other hand). Also the quick succession of effects with Mickey, his gaze management, his body language... prevent the spectator to even have the time to "rewind".

So yes and no.

No! A perfect tansfer "simulation" is important but the "move" is not what creates the deception even with the best performers of it.

Yes! Mickey is the unarguable master at the ROV that he has succeded making a deceptive "show" of.
Magic is the art of emotionally sharing live impossible situations
Mb217
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As always Mr. O, all "buts are welcomed, and your deeper dive here is appreciated and should make one think further for sure. Smile

But I would still say that I believe the move (ROV) initiates the need for everything else that Mickey does with it. In that, I would say further that everything is done around the ROV as the center attraction, and while all the slick false transfers are going on for sure as you say, they are going on "around" the the thing (ROV) that called them to action, bridging gaps just to get to the next show of of what might be comprehended as magic.

But your points are acute as I would expect, and of course move us forward even more as to greater thinking.

Thanks my friend. Smile
*Check out my latest: Gifts From The Old Country: A Mini-Magic Book, MBs Mini-Lecture on Coin Magic, The MB Tanspo PLUS, MB's Morgan, Copper Silver INC, Double Trouble, FlySki, Crimp Change - REDUX!, and other fine magic at gumroad.com/mb217magic Smile


"Believe in YOU, and you will see the greatest magic that ever was." -Mb Smile
Jiceh
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I didn't known Mickey silver. I've just seen a clip on youtube and it was really fabulous At the beginning I think it was ridiculous. At the end of the clip... wow!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YnbDnQJbYJA
CarpetShark
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Quote:
On 2013-09-16 22:09, Flyswatter wrote:
Quote:
On 2013-09-16 15:56, CarpetShark wrote:
I do not wish to start anything negative, but my guess is it's a rolling ROV. What do you guys think ? If I am out-of-line, please let me know.



It is not a rolling ROV Smile


Not the best example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OR4S5UBl_34
Flyswatter
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Quote:
On 2013-09-18 16:53, CarpetShark wrote:
Quote:
On 2013-09-16 22:09, Flyswatter wrote:
Quote:
On 2013-09-16 15:56, CarpetShark wrote:
I do not wish to start anything negative, but my guess is it's a rolling ROV. What do you guys think ? If I am out-of-line, please let me know.



It is not a rolling ROV Smile


Not the best example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OR4S5UBl_34



its funny seeing my own comment in this video from 3 years ago Smile