Is there some stack that contain in a way a si stebbin stack?
A stack which have no apparent order?
a la memnonica (which contain some other stacks)?

To ricardo,

Not sure I understand the question, but if I do, the answer is no. A Si Stebbins stack is a full deck stack. You can get into it starting from New Deck Order (at least from European New Deck Order) but of course NDO is very clearly a set-up.

Of course, any order or cards can be restored by doing 8 Faro's. And so, you could start with your Si Stebbins and give it 4 or five Faro's before you start. Then in performance, you do the other Faro's to return to it. Unfortunately, I believe that if you do six or seven Faro's the deck will be in a very clear order. This is not my speciality, but if you do 7 Faro's from SS, I think you will have a complete color separation.

Dennis Loomis

The idea, Dennis (and thank you for your answer) is, yes something like that.
To have an arrangement with no apparent order from which it is possible to go in the si stebbin order. Two stacks in one. And the same process in reverse.
In the way Tamariz manage his memnonica to stay stack and vice versa...
It's a stack I'm working on and I explore some possibilities. The first idea is to have a stay stack which "contain" the si stebbin and then to hide the stay stack order in a disordered order which will be memorized...

Hi Ricardo,

You might want to check out Denis Behr's book (Handcrafted Card Magic)as you explore your ideas. He has some great thinking on working your way into and out of a stack.

Eric

Guys, here is a question I get confused about. Is a stay stack the same as a mirror stack?

Thank you Eric for the tip.

Edh:yes, stay stack = mirror stack = reflected stack.

Thanks for the response Ricardo.

Dennis,

Could you direct me to a source to get into Si Stebbins order from NDO? Do you know if it is difficult to do?

Thanks!

Tom

I believe that Tim Conover has a memorized stack, which can lead to either North American NDO or Si Stebbins... however, I also believe, that as of this time, the stack remains unpublished.

Jeff

Edit: Of course, there's Steven Youell's 'The Hacker Stack' which involves using Si Stebbins as a memorized stack...

Tomboston:

I know you asked Dennis, not me, but I think I can answer your question: what you're looking for is "The Si Stebbins Secret" by Darwin Ortiz, in his book, At the Card Table. How difficult it is depends on your facility with faros, since you need to do a couple of perfect faros in the set up.

Thanks for the reference Phaedrus. Unfortunately my faros are less than perfect.

Thanks Jeff.
Is the Tim Conover stack structured to be stacked from NDO or St stebin via faro or not?

Thanks to Phaedrus for answering the question about going from NDO to SS. Yup, Darwin Ortiz explains this in At The Card Table.

And yes, it depends on Faro work.

Dennis Loomis

Thank you Dennis,

Unfortunately, I can't trust in my faro ability ( too much mistakes)...
So I will go on the pathways I explore (shuffles and displacements ...)

By the way, what I like very much in the Si Stebbin stack is that it is a tetradistick (it's the word?) stack. And I particulary like the effect "Spell of mystery" by Stewart James (which work with every tetradistikk (it's the word?)deck).

Nick Trost has a fairly expedient method in 'The Card Magic of Nick Trost'. It's not nearly as fast as Ortiz' method, but does the job well.
Ed

Ed,thank you for the tip

I have the Nick Trost book but I didn't see the method you mentionned. Can you give the page number? (Am I too lazy? )

Sure, page 321.

Thanks Ed

I am familiar with the Nick Trost method but I was looking for a way to go from NDO to SS in front of the spectators. Will the Ortiz method work for this?

Absolutely!