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gman Special user Lancaster, pa 751 Posts 
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Just my two cents here but I remember that there were plans on how to make a floating table on a seance dvd not long ago. Now granted the tabe the guy bult looked cheap and poorly made but even so he does give the idea on how they are made.
So, in the statements made above this guy is ripping off losander. I once heard I believe on this board of an inventor of magic state that he does in fact take tricks from Tarbell updates the look of the effect and sells them to magicians and I saw no cry of fowl from anyone that he was in the wrong. Now if you make it exactly the same and it is the same gimmick...you could be in the wrong...but...if you take the plans from one person and use a different gimmick then I say why not the plans are there for a reason. |
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Ray Pierce Inner circle Los Angeles, CA 2604 Posts
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Hey John...
I'm not talking about "sticking a zomb-- gi----k" under something and calling it original as I'm sure you know that device will not function on a table but only on a shape like a sphere. Losander utilized a very specific type of g------k for the table that is an extremely advanced and sophisticated design from Finn John through Tommy Wonder to apply to a floating table which before then was done with a vastly different method. I'm not sure of the relationship of Losander and Tommy Wonder but I'm sure he could explain that if you asked him. If you see someone doing a Losander Floating Table, and then get the idea to rip it off from that performance, then duplicate it with the same advancement in gim----k design on a table with a cloth... to the degree that the performance looks similar to the Losander design... than yes, I feel it's stealing. If you create an original effect that looks totally different from a floating table with you holding on to the table cloth... then it's different.
Ray Pierce
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gulamerian Special user 581 Posts
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"I found the new use for the material interesting as a project and even discussed it with Losander at a convention several years ago. He even offered advice as to finishing the wood."
According to doublelift's quote he has spoken to Losander about this. So what's the problem? Oh and by the way I do own a Losnder table. |
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Bill Palmer Eternal Order Only Jonathan Townsend has more than 24317 Posts
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Quote:
On 2008-12-29 23:51, doublelift wrote: Where did anyone ever say that Danny Dew created the Paul Fox cup? Paul Fox created the Paul Fox cup. He allowed Danny to manufacture the Paul Fox cups, as well as other items that Paul designed and/or invented. I have never seen a statement anywhere that Danny Dew created the Paul Fox cup.
"The Swatter"
Founder of CODBAMMC My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups." www.cupsandballsmuseum.com |
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PWB New user 71 Posts
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I have been using a floating table for years. It is not a Losander type table. I wish I owned a Losander Table. The unique part of the table is quite different form other floating tables. there shouldn't be anyhing wrong with improving the table, just don't copy some else's design.
Pay |
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marty.sasaki Inner circle 1117 Posts
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Too bad most magic things aren't patented, it would be easier to trace development and to determine what was different. I could then make sure mt idea was new, or I could make improvements.
I don't know how these things work, but from this thread I suspect I know the general idea. I can think of three different ways of doing this, since I don't know how Losander does it, I can't tell whether any of my ideas are unique. The current situation slows progress, which isn't always a bad thing. In the windows example, Xerox probably came up with the idea of windows and mice. Folks from Apple visited Xerox, and came out with the Lisa, then the Mac. Windows came out after that. Other companies came out with their own systems. They all used windows, menus, and mice. The original information was published widely, and Xerox could have controled everything stiffling the industry.
Marty Sasaki
Arlington, Massachusetts, USA Standard disclaimer: I'm just a hobbyist who enjoys occasionally mystifying friends and family, so my opinions should be viewed with this in mind. |
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MattMagician Regular user Erie, CO 190 Posts
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I'm a junior magician and I don't have near enough money to buy a losander's floating table. I feel like it is unethical and stupid to buy a knock off, therefore I have come to the decision of making my own. I have figured out what I believe to be the workings entirely but my only problem is the table staying completely upright. Can someone PM me with help?
Matt P.S.: Moderators, tell me if this needs to be rephrased or removed. My intentions are good.
Matt Simonsen
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Leland Stone Inner circle 1204 Posts
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Caveman 1: "See, the curve of this rock slab I've shaped reduces its friction on the ground, enabling it to roll. I call it The Wheel!
Caveman 2: "Wheel, eh? Looks handy, but thirty clams...each? Man, I can't afford even ONE...and I need TWO of 'em to make a...what'd you call it? A 'Cart?'" Days pass. Caveman 2: (On shellphone, long distance overseas call) "Shin? Yeah, I got a product I need made for a ground-floor market opportunity. I'm overnighting blueprints by pterodactyl... ." Some things just never change. 
Leland |
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DWRackley Inner circle Chattanooga, TN 1909 Posts
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Wow!
I found myself in a complete turnaround while reading this thread. I was thinking that IF I made something for my own use, and have no intention of reselling it, then I was pretty much in the clear. After reading both sides (neither of which deals with the original question, BTW), it occurs to me that when I play or sing at church (I’m a pianist), even though we work hard to make the sound “our own”, the original artist needs to be paid, and we do that through ASCAP fees. So where is the line drawn? Even a patent expires at some point. When we take a red eraser to the pips of a card, are we infringing on the FAKO deck? I tie loops in my invisible thread, but I’ve never bought the Million Dollar Knot. If I bend a spoon, should I send money to Uri Gellar? I’m not being facetious, here, just wondering. And watching this thread closely…..
...what if I could read your mind?
Chattanooga's Premier Mentalist Donatelli and Company at ChattanoogaPerformers.com also on FaceBook |
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owln_1 Loyal user dallas /now live by tulsa 222 Posts
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You can find this same song and dance every were on the Café. owln
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Micheal Leath Inner circle 1048 Posts
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Quote:
On 2009-06-06 15:08, gulamerian wrote: Apparently that's the part most seem to have missed. |
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Dennis Michael Inner circle Southern, NJ 5821 Posts
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I lover the Losander's table, however, in the past 50 years, I've never seen a table that looks like that. There may be one out there in some antique shop.
What would be nice is something that is easily recognizable float like this, and I am not talking about zombie violins, or other zombie type props. They are better than a silver ball. Doesn't every body have a silver ball on their end table in their home?
How about a floating chair? We have a floating glass with liquid poured in it, a floating cup, how about a floating iPhone or cell phone?
Dennis Michael
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MattMagician Regular user Erie, CO 190 Posts
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Floating cellphone: Jay Mattioli's "Roaming, the Cellphone Asrah." This utilizes something to the effect of a zombie gimmick but the phone vanishes in the end.
Matt Simonsen
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johnny0rocket New user 8 Posts
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I own a table that was made for me by a very dear friend and illusion builder that looks and feels much better than the Losander table. My friend made it using his own creative genius, his time, his money, and his ideas. So not only has he used his creativity well but he has also created a unique table for me that no one else has. The floating gimmick is just that, a standard floating gimmick... that he made himself.
If each one of us had to pay every time we used someone's basic magic principle and device, than I say God help all of us who use TTs everyday. You cannot claim infringement on someone for using a concept or principle of magic. Losander especially cannot claim this on his floating tables because he did not invent the concept or even the trick himself. The floating table goes back in magic history at least 200 years and while the concept and gimmick have evolved a great deal during that time, not much has really changed. |
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johnny0rocket New user 8 Posts
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Oh yeah and if you really wanna give credit where credit is due, thank Tommy Wonder for the floating table gimmick currently in use, not Losander.
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oldmagic009 New user 54 Posts
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Quote:
On 2008-12-29 00:04, Illusionist11 wrote: Please, Losander is mortal isn't he ... any good woodworker can reproduce a balsawood table ... good grief. If his tables were reasonably priced others would not likely try to build their own. I believe the word is hyperbole fits perfectly. |
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oldmagic009 New user 54 Posts
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Quote:
On 2010-02-16 09:34, johnny0rocket wrote: Thank you for stating this ... it needed to be said. In addition although I have always liked Tommy Wonder's presentations, I believe his zombie gimmick is essentially a modified gimbal ... pretty sure he did not invent the gimbal ... magicians are such silly hearts sometimes ... lighten up guys. |
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Anverdi-museum Inner circle 1201 Posts
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Tommy Wonder was indeed the creator of this type of floating table so fellow Magi's should knock it off with the loyalty to Losander. I own his table, I also own Dexter's table, Owen and Klamm's. I really do not care for the Losander one - it looks kind of strange. I personally use the Dexter one whenever a floating table is needed in my shows, it looks more natural - I did add a powerful magnet in the top center of this, with a modified pk ring I can also perform the classic version with the finger hook up as well as the zombie type, because it is magnetic - it breaks away instantly when a little pressure is exerted. My question is: Should Dexter owe money to L. for using the same design?
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Posted: Jun 6, 2009 02:11 pm 