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TheMag1cian Inner circle Ottawa, Ontario 1274 Posts 
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Harry makes another point. Many special needs children see things and catch on to what others may not. For instance, I perform for many who possess "savant" characteristics, meaning that they are very gifted in certain areas. I work with a teen who can recite the b-day of any celebrity. I work with another that can tell you the make and year of a car by the sound of it. These issues and more are what prompted the OP.
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21282 Posts
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Well it gets confusing when you want to use phrases in your OP such as "probably every magician has been in this situation while still in finger palm".
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21282 Posts
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I have a question. Is magic always the best way to try to relate to people? I mean if you know the trust issues or the linear thinking or autistic situation is it best to do magic for them?
I am being serious. Believe it or not I am not trying to squeeze your shoes. I am wondering if they like it in the first place?I am sorry if I seem obnoxious but I am sserious this is interesting. I am paid to perform. People come see me so it is a different dynamic. I know this may not be the right section for this sorry.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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TheMag1cian Inner circle Ottawa, Ontario 1274 Posts
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On 2013-04-12 11:45, Dannydoyle wrote: Agreed. I should've posted it differently. Now we know what I mean. |
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TheMag1cian Inner circle Ottawa, Ontario 1274 Posts
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On 2013-04-12 12:25, Dannydoyle wrote: Magic is an absolutely fantastic way to relate to this particular population. I was working with delay juvenile delinquints the other week. When I entered chairs were flying, 3 of them were being restrained and all I could hear was screaming and swearing. Within seconds I had evil stares my way. I performed Tagged (Sanders) first and all of a sudden I was their hero. A positive rapport was instantly established and there were no issues whatsoever. They just wanted to see more. In terms of autism and the lower functioning individuals on the spectrum magic enthralls them. And as Harry mentioned many of them catch on very quickly which puts them ahead of the neurotypical children which consequently raises them on the social hierarchy. Similarly, teaching them magic, as Ive said before in this thread also raises them on the social hierarchy (solves bullying issues, they get more social attention and stigma is reduced). While doing inclusion (integrating autistic kids in to normal schools), I saw the autistic children being alienated, standing alone on the playground and being made fun of. After teaching them magic by the end of the year I was able to stand back as the all the children flocked towards them to see magic. They were basically the most popular kids out there. Also, in my ABA sessions, if I do a trick before my sessions they're more prone to cooperate and learn more due to a positively established rapport. So to answer your question .. yes, I do absolutely believe that magic is a fantastic way to help "build" that trust, engage them in more social reciprocity and improve their self efficacy, self image, etc. As Ive said in earlier posts .. they LOVE the magic. Much of the time they can not contain themselves (hence running at me out of "excitement and joy" not because they feel threatened. They feel my hands nonetheless (not knowing personal space) which again was the purpose of the OP. Trust me .. I wouldnt be doing this if I had a kind of inkling that they did not like it or weren't having a good time. Having described my situation many times now .. would you possibly have some constructive input (perhaps some effects that suit the context in question?) We know are cognizant that they love it and that my technique may not be the culprit here. Also, I'm not taking anything personally don't worry. I posted in this section because Ill often do "strolling" in the Caféteria (while they're eating lunch) or bedroom to bedroom so I felt it met the criteria of this section. |
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Nick Singh Regular user Singapore 133 Posts
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About 5 years ago I used to perform at the MINDs organization for autistic children. I don't perform for kids normally (I am awful with kids) but this was for a good cause so I did it for free. There was one situation where I was performing spongeballs for them and I asked them, "what is 1 + 1 everyone? " and I did the standard load leaving me with 4 in my hand. All the adults said 2 and the kids started screaming "1 + 1 is 4!!!" Obviously that spoilt the surprise but the kids loved it.
Haha I can definitely relate to the situation you are in. The only advice I can give is to avoid routines where you put yourself in a situation where you could fail. We are constantly told audience participantion is great and all that but these little dudes live by different rules so I would limit audience participation to more questions and answers instead of getting them to physically hold things etc. I have to say that performing for them is incredibly fulfilling and the people who take care of autistic kids at these centres are angels. Really helps me understand how fortunate I am not to be born with any disabilities.
Magician and Emcee in Singapore - www.nick.com.sg
Youtube channel of travel videos and podcasts - www.youtube.com/user/blackchilliwing/videos |
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manal Inner circle York ,PA. 1412 Posts
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On 2013-04-12 12:25, Dannydoyle wrote: Magic is not always appropriate. often other approaches are more effective. Magic may be appropriate at times. I have a ten yr old son with spectrum disorder autism. He strongly dislikes magic. |
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TheMag1cian Inner circle Ottawa, Ontario 1274 Posts
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On 2013-04-12 21:35, Nick Singh wrote: Precisely. It's a very rewarding career .. that's for sure. |
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TheMag1cian Inner circle Ottawa, Ontario 1274 Posts
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On 2013-04-13 01:06, manal wrote: I've not yet run into any on the spectrum who havent enjoyed the magic as of yet but there's still time. Its tricky because you have to take their sensory modalities into consideration while choosing effects. If overstimuation occurs they can get irritated and noticably anxious. Have you ever tried teaching your son a few effetcs? This has changed the social lives of many of my students/clients. |
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TheMag1cian Inner circle Ottawa, Ontario 1274 Posts
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Manal: I also wanted to mention that all I do everyday of my life are the "other approaches" (intergration, Applied Behavioral Analysis, teaching social skills, activities of daily living, emotional awareness training) all the while using their personal interests as reinforcers. Thus, I don't want it to come across like Im utilizing magic as the only approach to "relate" to and/or instill trust in them. It's just a fun thing I do on the side that I'm finding very fun, different and entertaiing for them. You are correct in that magic is "not always appropriate" and you have to really know your audience in this context.
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David Fillary Special user 662 Posts
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I would guess that the Raven could work very well here as long as you can get one of them to keep his hand still and not take the coin before the vanish. They can search your hands all they like afterwards!
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TheMag1cian Inner circle Ottawa, Ontario 1274 Posts
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On 2013-04-13 13:53, David Fillary wrote: Very very true. How could I have forgotten the good old raven? Digging it out of my drawer as we speak. Thanks for the reminder! Nice, Clean vanish! |
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Alan Munro.jpg "View Profile") Inner circle Kentwood, Michigan, USA 5958 Posts
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On 2013-04-11 18:01, jay leslie wrote: Too bad the guy didn't know to keep secrets and to keep his wounded ego in check. He has too much to learn. Many lawyers drown their emotions in booze and/or drugs, so they don't face their parasitic existences. Although I don't mention names, I've got some stories to tell about outrageous behavior at business functions. |
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TheMag1cian Inner circle Ottawa, Ontario 1274 Posts
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On 2013-04-13 16:20, Alan Munro wrote: This has happened to me once before too albeit not with a coin effect and surprize suprize .. it was indeed a lawyer as well. Any time I try to discuss this in the Café I get told its my presentation/performance (even though it's so extremely rare that this happens - like once a year). Sometimes you have to shift focus from "why it happened" to "how to manage it" .. for the other 99% of time focus on "why it happened" and work on presentation. In the behavioral field there are 2 main reasons maladpative behaviors occur. 1. "attention-seeking" and 2. "escape-avoidant". I would guess some of these spectators enjoy the attention of being able to call out the magician, especially those with ego's seepng out every crevice of their being. We must do what Jay did and use the process of extinction (or .. ignoring) and the art of redirection (let me show you something else). If you feed in to it, you professionalism decreases and it will affect your whole set. |
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ShirtlessKirk Loyal user 236 Posts
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In Vernon's biography you learn that Vernon performed for this group that had seen Malini and they called Malini out when he palmed cards. I'm certain that Malini's technique/presentations were just fine so it can happen to the very best.
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TheMag1cian Inner circle Ottawa, Ontario 1274 Posts
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Malini got called out? don't feel so bad now.
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Dennis Loomis 1943 - 2013 2113 Posts
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Here's a disarming approach to showing your hands empty when you actually do have something palmed. It is better suited for stage although could be done from the pockets as well.
The performer reaches into his table or case and brings out a handkerchief and wipes his hands with it, in the process showing each of his hands to be empty. How? Very simple. Imagine that you have a silver dollar palmed in your hand. (Possibly it is the first coin you will produce for a Miser's Dream Routine.) Reach into the table with the hand holding the coin and leave the coin inside and come out with the handkerchief. Use the handkerchief to wipe your hands, flashing the empty hands. (Don't make a big deal of showing your hands empty. Just flash the inside of the hands.) When the handkerchief is returned to the table, you retrieve the coin and go on with your work. Dennis "Denny" Loomis
Itinerant Montebank
<BR>http://www.loomismagic.com |
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Dennis Loomis 1943 - 2013 2113 Posts
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Re: "Outrageous behavior at business functions." I did a show for a group of executives and their wives which was held in a banquet room which had no stage or platform. Because of the size of the room my set-up was only a few feet from the spectators. I finished with the Color Changing Plumes which I used because I thought the ladies would enjoy it and the use of music made for a nice finish to the show. When the show was over, the President of the group came up and thanked me and we were chatting. I looked up to see another of the executives. He had removed one of the (gaffed) plumes from the stand and had pulled out the the gimmick, exposing the effect.
At a school I had gotten set up for a school show and left the multi-purpose room to go and change into my costume. The room had been empty and my main table had been closed up. When I returned, the Principal of the school was standing at my table which he had opened up and he was picking up things and looking them over! Dennis "Denny" Loomis
Itinerant Montebank
<BR>http://www.loomismagic.com |
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MikeTheKid Veteran user vancouver 329 Posts
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I am believing in misdirection
It works for me 
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Magic is a performing art that entertains an audience by creating illusions of seemingly impossible.... www.mikeliumagic.com |
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Chessmann Inner circle 4247 Posts
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Good technique helps, etc...., but there will always be someone.
Don't fight it, but roll with it. "I would, but I haven't seen my manicurist ately". Sometimes a good laugh can disarm them enough for you to get an opportunity to ditch! I have a saying that I am prepared to use but have not had the occasion to (fortunately) and I hope I never need it. It would be for a real pest. It starts with: "I'm sorry, but once a performer allows his audience to dictate to him, he is lost."
My ex-cat was named "Muffin". "Vomit" would be a better name for her. AKA "The Evil Ball of Fur".
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Posted: Apr 12, 2013 01:37 am 