I have just recently been working on a routine with a fast and loose chain. Does anybody here do a fast and loose routine, and if so where did you learn it? I have the School for Scoundrels notes which are great, but I was looking for even more sources.





Thanks,

Tilt

Marc Desouza has a video package, published by the Camirand Academy of Magic in Quebec. George Blake's Loopy Loops is an excellent resource, as is Ganson's Art of Close Up Magic. Doc Wayne has a routine on audio tape that is okay. David Roth has a routine in one of his old Lecture Notes. Of all of these, I recommend the Blake book first, which is out of print, but fairly readily available from eBay or used magic book dealers.

Johnny Thompson has a wonderful version on volume 2 of his "Commercial Classics of Magic" video set. That's the one that made me want to learn it.

I use one of the routines from School for Scoundrels but I recently saw a routine that may change this. Chuck Smith's routine with the endless chain is completely different than anything I have ever seen. It is done in the hands rather than on the table and I think it is great.

I have been doing an in the hand version for years (god, it's actually decades!!).

I am completely unfamiliar with Chuck Smith's routine, so could you say a bit more about what you mean by "in the hands". Obviously, no table is involved, but how is it set up?

In my handling, the loops are constructed using the hands of the spectators. They then have the loop on their wrists, with one hand in one opening and the other hand in the other opening. They just have to remove one hand from the loop, and the result is revealed. Is this in any way similar to the Chuck Smith handling?

Bye for now

Harold

I've seen the Chuch Smith handling but have not gotten the manuscript yet so I cannot tell you too much but I can tell you that it was not just taking the tabled version and doing it in the hands. It involved wrapping the chain around your finger with 2 ends hanging down. The spectator pulled on one of the ends and it would catch or not catch your finger. At least thats what I remember. Maybe someone else who has also seen it can comment.

The School for Scoundrels book is the last word on the subject of Fast & Loose. You really can't do better. Johnny Thompson's routine on the Commercial Classic of Magic tape is definitely worth checking out as well, but I'd say you should own the Thompson video tapes even if you never plan to do Fast & Loose. Those tapes are the best!

Jim

Thanks for all the help guys.

Tilt

I will just echo Scott and say that Marc DeSousa has a book on Fast and loose and he shows 3 different layer approaches and a double layout where you can let a spec on one side decide if he wants fast or loose, and you can pull it. The other spec plays as always and BOTH loose.

This was my first F&L venture in many years, and I liked getting a Chain that works well (French serpentine) and a video in one package. I did the effects right along with the reveal portion of the tape, and then was able to do them without the tape. Simple - but powerful.

I love the concept of Endless Chain/Fast and Loose. So I want more material too.

I was looking at the Scoundrels samples on their web site, but I wonder how good the pictures really are for learning? I do good from videos, and live instructors, and it takes me a lot longer with books. I would have bought them in a moment if there was a video from them. Are the notes really that good??

BroDavid

My favorite "in the hands" version comes from Robert Neale's "Tricks of the Imagination" called The Swindler, The Shill, and My Uncle".

Now that sounds like my kinda routine
The Swindler, The Shill and my Uncle.

BroDavid, rejoice as Chef Anton has put out a video on the fast and loose!

Bye for now

Harold

Thanks Harold!

In my last post, I said Marc DeSousa had a book (and he may) but I ws referring to his chain gang video.

And as for Chef Anton's video, I will go looking for that one right away. Thanks for the the heads up, friend!

BroDavid

"Loopy Loop" by George Blake and a chapter in "The Art of Close up Magic" by Lewis Ganson (It's a Gamble, Endless Chain, page 86, Vol. 1) Pre-date the other references by about 50 years (That doesn't mean that they aren't as good) although I couldn't find a publication date in either book.

There is a killer move for endless chain in a book on mentalism by Patrick Schlagel, but I still have to finish, then publish it.

I agree with BroDavid about the relative merits of video and notes when it comes to learning an effect.
My intro to F&L came from Marc DeSousa's vid which I found to be not only an entertaining routine but reasonably easy to learn. I've also obtained Whit Haydn's notes but, despite the obvious quality and excellence of the content, I find it much harder to learn the subtleties of the action. Maybe I'm just lazy!