I was thinking about Ichazod's original question, and comparing magic to food. Think of a simple meal. The food can be good enough. It can be properly handled and prepared. The right mix of nutritionally adequate ingredients. If you served someone this food they'd probably appreciate it.

Now take the exact same meal, but prepared by a master chef using the finest ingredients. It would be a meal they'd probably remember the rest of their lives.

What are you serving. Is it JUST good enough?

Ichazod,

This is a great post! It's something I've had revelations about for quite sometime...

In light of my wifes pregnacy, I've had the hard reality hit me! All those dreams of me building up a grand scale illusion show is a bit far fetched. I now have another mouth to feed and a whole list of new responsibilities. I'm sure some years down the road, I'll be able to acheive my goals as a performer; however, I know what really matters now is being a good father, husband, provider, etc.

Our art holds so many weird levels... When is enough enough? What makes us true masters of our art? What determines successful? These are always questions that hinder me...

I feel fortunate to have a good friend like you within the magic community (I guess that's why I'm so bummed about you moving to San Francisco). I love magic! I love the history of this art; as well as, the various forms of it. I've found that when I'm getting burnt out (as far as magic goes), it is when I am wrapped up in the "will this fool my magic buddies?" or "is this the ethical way of doing this" or more recently "what can I do to leave my mark?"...

I envy my peers who can sit through two hours of David Blaine and walk away feeling entertained. My wife will sit and watch Mindfreak and guess all the possible methods....never nailing one of 'em. I guess those days are long gone for me (who knows about the future). Sometimes I wish I were as naive to this art as she is... Instead I lose sleep over effects and am waisting away my days drawing sketches of illusions that may never be reality... Regardless, magic is something I embrace and focus on each day.

You and I are alike in many ways:
- We are always striving to better our art.
- We always try to personalize an effect so it becomes a signature routine in our arsonal...
- We will always be students of the art!

I think that is what seperates us from the flock...

You are so fortunate to have the "magic man" status in your community. I try to establish that here as well. I guess you can say you are a master of the art within your area! You are right... we perform because we love to... When it all boils down, the respect of the lay-audience is the most important part of the art (from the other end of the spectrum). As long as they have a good time, you'll have a good time and visa versa... It's a vicious circle.

Never lose your flame for the art!

Your brother in magic,
Bryan Gilles

p.s.- you need to come into town so we can session again!

Good mentor's want their proteges to be original.

Define original in the field of magic. There has been a big question on the subject of original effects. I don't feel that a good magician has to know one single original effect to be original. Do you agree Kregg?

Let me add my thanks for this topic.

I often have to remind myself that I can learn and perform some really fun and entertaining magic without becoming overwhelmed by all the knucklebusting stuff.

I read about it, I watch it, I try to learn it and most of all I appreciate it and I may get there in time. But for now, I have fun and try to learn and perform routines I enjoy, to the best of my ability.

Best,

Jon

I am appauled by the idea that "original" equals good. That hasn't been expressed here, but it always winds up comming up. Original and bad is still bad.

Really? I would have expected the opposite, at least at first. Originality comes much later in the mentoring process, after you have a firm grasp on what worked well for past masters.

Some great performers were never original. Segovia wasn't a composer. But he'd play works from other composers to perfection. And heaven help his student who doesn't play a piece "his way."

Segovia: "Why did you play that phrase the way you did?"
Student: "I thought it worked better that way."
Segovia: "Are you saying that the composer wrote it wrong? Or that I've been playing it wrong all these years? Get out of my studio and don't come back until you can play it correctly!"

Yes but who ever heard of Segovia.

Didn't he publish a book of self working card tricks?

A friend mine who is now 61 years old, was a degenerate gambler all his life and he has six kids and he never stopped trying to be the best poker player in the world. A couple years back anyone would have advised him to join gamblers anonymous . However last year in various poker comps he won about ½ a million bucks and he is now ranked the overall European poker champion and getting sponsored to play and giving advice on TV and so on. Is that good enough for him? Well no it’s not for him, he wants to be the world champ and good luck to him. Someone has remarked there are no great men only ordinary men who attempt great things and succeed. Micky, my friend, is known as “The Worm” you could say he is worm that turned. Micky is not exactly a success story but at least he tried and is still trying. Micky loves the game and will never stop trying to be the best. Anyone can anything if they can pay the price but the price can too much for some.
Just earning living and feeding your family is a thing to be admired and if your content with that then that is fine. But if you want to be the European champ, well then the kids will just have to starve, according to Micky.

I think I understand to what degree you meant that. Let's also keep in mind that a good mentor will teach a student to master the traditional methods first, a foundation from which to work with, if you will, and then if it rears it's ugly head, delve into originality.

I've never been a mentor and don't want to be one. I've been too busy searching for one and those I've found willing to help are very very far away. But it'll have to do.

I'm re-learning a lot of things as I've never had a mentor and forewent many basics in pursuit of originality. Most of those efforts were retarded at best. In returning to some basics, I've improved, and it's given way to some originality here and there.

If none of the above works, if you can, go fishing and then return to it all with a fresh mind.

I wonder how many of the great mentors approached it the way you did Randy? I too was mentor-less. I had a local shop keeper who knew good value. He also figured out where my interest lied and steered me to good sources (Wilson, Ammar, Tarbell). But he was no great magician. He liked self workers and presented them as if he just read the instructions. I floundered around in originality by myself for a while. But I kept bumping in to those darned classics. Each time I gave in, I stood in awe of it's structure. I don't know if I would have approached them with such care and respect, if I hadn't put in the time.

As we grow older, we realize that some of our dreams cannot be attained and we accept who we are and what we can achieve. This makes us peaceful and we grow.

On the other hand all these "successful" people I know have these huge egos. They are very opinionated. If they are very enthusiastically saying "Yes" today, tomorrow they will say it for the opposite with equal enthusiasm. They talk a lot and are usually very loud. Basically they are very into themselves.

So I don't know, maybe we should forget about who we are and strive to be become what we want to be. If you forget that you are just a man, usually others do as well.

Well some of those folks can be just like that I suppose.

However, not all great people are like that. In fact, the greatest wouldn't be recognized at a table setting or in a crowd if it weren't for the fact that someone recognized their face. Such greats also exist.

If you want to be a complete jerk then try it. I just feel less and less need to prove anything to anyone as much as I'd like to just improve on my act one day at a time.


Posted: Jun 25, 2006 2:59am
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Yeah once in a while I hear a short echo that sounded sweet enough for me to ask sam to play it again:

[quote]On 2006-06-25 01:13, RandyStewart wrote:

Nice. And I don't have to worry about the quoted disagreeing with me!

Nice indeed Randy. Someone said to me once, hard work never goes unrewarded, it just seems like it has at times.

Randy Stewart wrote: I don't think we've heard of or seen much success with "tribute magicians". Lets not forget about chung ling soo.

I have to say that I have found the human condition to be much more complicated than that. How people progress through life, what their goals are, and how they set those goals varies widely from person to person. No two people are the same, we are each a product of our genes and our environment, constantly growing and evolving. Yes, their are trends, but what I find with excessive egos, is that they tend to believe their own tales. That is really true with all of us. Each of us has a reality that we have created. There is no way to peer through the veil, but if you could, you would find that what you see, the world tinted with your experiences and prejudices, is very different from the one that each and every other person does, and no two are alike. As a magician, we should be acutely aware that judging things based on the information our 5 senses give us, is easily and often not correct.

A valid definition of success is "The achievement of something desired, planned, or attempted". This definition has no inherent reference to fame, television, money, or wealth. Neither does my definition, or the definition used by many others, I would assume. To me, success does not currently even involve making a living wage from magic, in fact I am currently working in the opposite direction. In my goal, success is defined by the relationship I have with those I work with, and the reputation I develop and maintain as a result of those relationships. I would regard a consistently good performance as more of a success than an inconsistently spectacular performance. That is not to say that I do not wish for my performances to have the most impact possible, simply that consistency is my priority, not impact. As of the writing of this post, I'm the guy who shows up early, entertains the crowd very well from a few minutes before scheduled to a few minutes after, then goes home. I'm the one aspect of an event that a contractor need not even give a second thought as they go about stamping out fires. I feel like when an event planner is deciding between me and that other guy who is a huge natural talent, but an equally huge flake, they will go with me, because in the end, rain or shine, good day or bad, they will receive the same quality product, and not have to attend any little quirks I might have. To me, that reputation is success, and it's the kind of success a lot of performers would serve themselves and their customers well to strive for.

It's kind of funny how "the greats" are regarded by some. I've had a chance to know some of "the greats" in more than one field, not just magic, but in some others, as well.

How they react to the rest of us mere mortals depends a lot upon the circumstances under which we meet them. For example, when I was working in a music shop in Houston, I met the late Bill Haley (of Bill Haley and the Comets). He was buying a guitar for his grandson. He was not full of himself, and he was a very pleasant individual.

I also met Jerry Garcia. He spent about 20 minutes with me and a couple of the other "dead" in my studio, while Bob Weir bought a guitar from one of our salesmen. We talked about philosophy, blues, music and bluegrass. I really enjoyed that.

I knew Harry Blackstone, Jr. quite well. We worked at Magic Island together. He was never anything but cordial and friendly to me.

Modern guys -- Jeff McBride -- nice guy. I met him at a birthday party at Losander's. He knew who I was -- introduced me to everyone there. I had never met him before in my life. But that wasn't the impressive thing to me. The impressive thing happened at the Magic Circle Centenary. I introduced a kid about 13 years old to him while we were waiting for the theater to open. He took several minutes with the boy.

I could list more examples like this. The big-headed guys are usually only big-headed if you act arrogant around them. Or if you push yourself on them when they are trying to talk to someone or eat dinner or whatever. Just imagine yourself in their positions.

I was really fortunate that when I needed mentoring, someone showed up. None of my mentors, other than Howard Campbell and David Casey, were people I spent a lot of time with. But I got information and suggestions from them, and then had a chance to show them the results later. They understood and were helpful.

I was also fortunate to have good models. I learned a lot watching Van Cleve. His style didn't fit me at all, but some of his ideas did. My guillotine routine was based upon his finger chopper routine -- with his blessing.

I also discovered that every successful television magician, whether I could imitate him or not, was a potential springboard for me.

Magic has recently made stronger inroads into the African American community. This is largely due to the success of David Blaine. Yes, there have been African American magicians for a long time, but hiring a magician for a birthday party was not as popular a thing, because (at least to my way of thinking) there were few examples on television to inspire that particular market to think of magic as "their" entertainment. So now Blaine comes along.

I started getting inquiries from that sector right after his appearance. Sometimes the questions went "I saw this guy, what's his name, did a really great card trick on the street, can you do that?"

"Well, I do some things that are similar. Want to see one?" Then I would do the ID or any other routine I was comfortable with. They had never seen it. They were impressed. I often got hired.

Here's the thing about this. Most lay people have never seen any of the things we do in person. Some don't even know that magicians are available for hire. Whose fault is this?

When someone like Criss Angel, David Blaine or David Copperfield awakens people to our existence, take advantage of it. Don't knock them. The audience uses them as a yardstick. If you entertain that audience with your material, whatever it is, they will most likely be very happy with what you do, and you will have a chance to spread magic, just like Johnny Appleseed spread apple trees.

Don't strive to be good enough. Strive to be the best you can be.

Am I as good as I need to be...YES I am! Am I as good as I want to be...NO!!!

Mike

Am I as good as I need to be...Yes I am! Am I as good as I want to be...Yes!!!

They will get suspicious if I win another pot, and I don't want to look too good to be true.

Tommy