I was wondering how many of you have memorized both Aronson and Mnemonica? If you have them both memorized, do you get them confused? I I have Aronson's stack memorized, but am interested in purchasing Mnemonica. I am worried that many of the effects will be dependent on the specific stack. I am also worried that if I learn Mnemonica in addition to Aronson, I'll mix them up. What are your experiences?

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Jan

Thanks, Jan! I followed most of the thread before it derailed.

I first learned Aronson but not "cold." I then learned Mnemonica and now have it down. I have found that my original weak mastery of Aronson is weaker still since I moved away from it. That said, when I read some of Simon's stack-specific work in A Card to Remember and Try the Impossible, it does still seem to be in there, some place. I imagine that, if I really wanted to, I could master Aronson as well and not confuse it with Mnemonica, but I am not sure I need or want to. I do have Tamariz's Mnemonica and most of the Aronson books, and I have to say that ever since I have gotten bitten by the memdeck bug, it has been stack-independent effects that I like the best. Simon's books have a pile of them--indeed, his early works in Bound to Please include wonderful stack-independent effects that were published even before Simon published his own stack--the instructions say only that a memorized deck is used, but what stack and how it is memorized is up to the performer. There are of course piles of excellent stack-independent effects out there by the likes of Asi Wind, Michael Close, and Vincent Hedan, to name a few. In any case, I recommend the Tamariz book enthusiastically no matter what stack one settles on. It is full of excellent stack-independent effects and tips on advanced card handling that are great to learn no matter one's stack of choice. Frankly, I don't pay much attention to the stack-dependent effects in either Mnemonica or Aronson's books. There is plenty of other stuff there to keep me very busy.

Thanks for the response. A buddy of mine highly recommended Mnemonica even though I know Aronson. I'll be picking it up.

It is a fantastic book; some routines are stack dependent as you find some also by Aronson (specially in his "Try the Impossible"). But the strongest material is stack independent which is true for Tamariz and Aronson. You should decide then if you really want to memorize a second stack. For myself I didn't see any reason for it. Jan

My friend actually said basically the same thing, Jann. I think I'll stick with the Aronson stack but pick up Mneminca.

^ I'm w/ Jan. Use Mnemonica stack AND Aronson's material.

I'm with lcwright, Atom and Jan. For me, the most impactful are the stack independent tricks. Many of the built-in stack tricks are poker deals and the like. Nice to have but certainly not essential. The vast bulk of Tamariz and Aronson's mem deck offerings are stack independent anyway so there's not really a whole lot of stuff you're missing out on regardless of which stack you choose.

Cool, that makes justifying the purchase of Mnemonica so much easier. I have Aronson down cold and would like some more routines. I'm currently using about 4 routines- some Darwin Ortiz stuff, a Bill Malone routine, and a routine of my own. I have Simply Simon and like some of the routines, but I want something comprehensive on mem deck.

Simon has a new book coming out soon which I hope has even more Mem deck work in it. I can't get enough of Two Beginnings!

For a few months I knew my own stack, the Mnemonica and the Aronson. Never was confused, a bit like being fluent in 3 languages (which was also my case at the time, I don't know if that helped with stack compartmentalization). However I "stopped knowing" Mnemonica and Aronson in the end because I use mine the most, and I never found an effect that really required to master more than one stack.

I learnt Aronson stack first, then Switched to Mnemonica because of the new deck order finale you can perform. I love that. I knew Aronson stack cold, had worked on it for quite some time and I knew both stacks off by heart for a short while without confusing them, but I just use mnemonica now and have completely forgotten the Aronson stack apart from card 1 and 52.

It isn't hard to memorize more than one stack as long as each one is memorized in a different context. For example, Mnemonica could be all images in a painting, where the Aronson stack could be all images of things at the mall. So you don't just remember "King Diamond smoking a cigar" - you remember a *painting* of King Diamond smoking a cigar, or King Diamond smoking a cigar in the food court. Be consistent that way, and you'll never mix them up.

TerrorInt,

Your comment about multiple contexts is valid while you are still in the learning mode and require then mnemonic aid for the translation of card value and stack value. But in order to know your stack cold, you should instantaneously know that with Aronson, the KD == 14, without any mnemonic aids. (Over time, you will completely forget the mnemonic aids for your stack.)

I have shifted my approach recently for how to keep the stacks separate without translation aids. For the Aronson Stack, I imagine that the stack values have black numbers. In other words the King of Diamonds has a black font for the number 14. And for my own personal stack, the stack value numbers have a red font. I have found this to be very effective, and it leverages your mind's ability to maintain that distinction.

Nick

For some 25 years I worked with a memorized stack. 3 years I changed to a stack of my own and for me the transition was hard. For safety I started to work with the new stack after a month where I had nog gigs. At first working with the new stack when a number was called, beyond my control the name of the card of the old stack would immediately pop up. Then I would have the internal dialogue no it is not, it is the .... Anyway it took me a long time and a lot of rehearsels to get the old stack out of my system.