Hi all,

I've got a routine that requires a stack of 20 cards on the top of the deck. While I can go straight into the routine like that, it would be nice if I could get the deck shuffled by an audience member first. Any ideas on a practical method for walkaround work? Short of a deck switch of course; and copping off 20 cards is a little obvious! Perhaps they don't have to handle the whole deck - just give them the impression they had?

That seems like a pretty tall order. I'm sure there are some guys around here that have a method. I don't know of a really good one. You are right, that is a lot of cards to hold out, you would be giving the spectator only a little more that half the pack. That would be too obvious.

Can't you get away with showing them that the pack is "truly mixed" with a few false shuffles and/or cuts?

Yeah I could... and simply shuffle them myself. The routine's fine as it stands... just thought it'd be nice to be able to throw in something where they shuffle the deck to begin with. I'm currently playing around with something along the lines of "hey, you shuffle this half... and you, shuffle this half" kind of idea.

Maby let them cut and then reverse it

Shuffle the deck by yourself, stack on top, overhand shuffle the deck with faces to spectators, and shuffle off the first 30 cards, anf throw the rest behind the shuffled off cards.

Thanks for your replies... appreciate it.

Simon Aronson has a routine (I can't recall the name or book) where he lets an audience member give the deck ONE (and only one) true riffle shuffle. The idea is that you still have a stack--you just have two stacks running concurrently.

Cesar,

Yes, Aronson has a awesome magician fooler called "Some People Think" which was originally published in Kabbala and reprinted in Simply Simon. Although this does use a full deck stack and you do let the specky do a legitimate riffle shuffle I do not think this is exactly what nique is looking for. Just wanted to clear up Aronson's thing there.

P.S. Check out the trick!

My feeling is that it's just unnecessary. If you learn a good in the hands false riffle (e.g. Hollingworth), you will accomplish your goals of having your spectators believe the cards are thoroughly shuffled. And especially if you can fan the deck at least most of the way and show the cards in a random condition. False riffle shuffles simply are not even imagined by spectators. Any *slight* level of credibility that you would be getting with a spec shuffle would be more than outweighed by the negatives of a deck switch.

However, if you crimp the bottom card, you can have them cut the deck after you do the false riffle. Then while you are pattering you can nonchalantly cut to the crimp and be done with it. You could do a pass, but you don't even need to make a "move" out of it. Just cut it nonchalantly while you are engaging them in your witty banter. Then, when you do the final revelation for your effect, remind them that the deck was "shuffled, and cut by you!" This is a sneaky way of saying it, so that it almost seems like they also did the shuffling. You'll find that half of the time, they will even have a vague memory of shuffling in addition to cutting!

Nique, check your PM...

All the best,

:bikes: Mesquita

Don't worry about audience shuffles, or deck switches, or any of that. There's a much simpler solution: don't perform this trick as your opener.

First, perform 2 or 3 other tricks that leave the stack undisturbed (if you go through the tricks you already know, you'll be surprised how many leave most of the deck undisturbed). THEN perform this trick with the 20 card stack. It'll save you a lot of unnecessary work and the trick will have a bigger impact. Even magicians don't see a stack coming when a few non-stack tricks have been performed first.

Very wise advice indeed. I wish more people would heed it. I think the same is true for color changing deck routines as well. You see them done as openers a lot, but I think that is a weak choice. They are really much more effective as closers. A good color changing deck effect is definitely worth a switch.

Paul and Scorch: Thanks for the advice. I hadn't thought about that and it makes perfect sense.

Craig

Woot! Thanks for all your input. Thanks to Mesquita as well for his PM. Will be trying that sequence out.

Just want to add a suggestion of Allan Ackerman. If you are going to let the spec do one riffle shuffle, YOU cut the deck in half and hand it to him or her. Don't just hand it to them and tell them to riffle shuffle. Disaster awaits. This is from his "False Deals" video, though I'm sure others have used the concept. Take care.

Matt

It's more work than I'd probably do, but conceptually you could:

-Hand them the non-stacked half to shuffle while you false-shuffle the stack, instructing them to "Mix that half like this...";
-Have them drop their half on top of yours;
-Get a break and perform a pass while straightening the deck;
-Cut off the top half for you, give them the (same cards in the) bottom half, again instructing them to shuffle "like this"; and
-Perhaps finalize things with a false cut.


Regards,

-jjg

Good thinking jgravelle! Personally, though, I'd skip the pass and simply do a push through or strip out with the two halves (or a Zarrow then ditch the top card.) If someone isn't convinced the cards are shuffled by that point they're either a magician, or will never be convinced. Take care.

Matt

Use a stripper deck and only let them shuffle once. just an idea.
be well,
JW

You should read the absoult magic by Derren Brown, watch his lecture or read Drwing room decpetion by Guy Hollingworth in particular the Trojon Horse trick they have excellent methods of ways rond this. THESE ARE MUST READS!!

Some great ideas here. I think that with my little experience, the only thing I can say is to reiterate what others have said and it probably isn't necessary if you start by performing 2 or 3 effects which leave the stack unaltered then false shuffle them yourself - that should be fine.

Tom R