If it didn't happen, then why does my friend have a copy of the lecture dvd?

I've watched it. Watched James explain the routine. Watched him explain how and why it works.

My problem is how easily this can get sweeped under the carpet.



Ever watch those lawyer movies, or Law and order tv series?

The lawyer wants the jury to think something, even though it doesn't have anything to do with the clients case, Example: Woman is on trial for the death of one of her children. Not enough evidence to prove it. So the lawyer brings up her past mistakes be it the woman was on trial in the past for beating her kids, even though she has had counciling, and by courts opinion her problem is taken care of.

All you have to do is mention it. Even if its stricten off the record. Its still in the jury's mind.

Marketing works the same way.

You keep saying that the coin on shoulder was not released, but I have seen the video my friend bought from James' website. Once you release that, we won't have to keep going in circles.

I have the dvd. Coin on shoulder is not on there! The coin routine is. I've never suggested otherwise. You can't have seen a copy with coin on shoulder as it was never there No copies were EVER made with it on.

James did not include coin on shoulder in his lecture dvd. Period

Say others people lies because they don't agree with you is a behaviour of kid.
So, I call you kid.

I understand our point of views and arguments don't interested you.
You hold the truth it's great.
But I understand, you're teenager(if you're not it's sad) and listen what others people have to say is hard.
It's my last post about it.
we don't go anywhere here.

Ok I'd like to chime in here quickly to see if this can be cleared up once and for all.

James's release Fancy a Pot of Jam was never released due to the coin on shoulder being on the DVD.

This resulted in Still Fancy a Pot of Jam being released which DID NOT teach the Coin on Shoulder routine.

James then released, after a lecture tour, (in which I believe he taught the coin on shoulder at most venues) a lecture DVD. This DID teach his version of coin on shoulder during the routine which involved a back of the hand load, a load in his eye, a coin under watch, coin on shoulder and and watch steal which ended with watch on shoulder. This was then taken off of the lecture DVD due to another eruption about the whole coin on shoulder saga.

So there are videos and clips that can be found from the past in which James does indeed teach coin on shoulder, I know, I have a lecture DVD and I attended a lecture of James's (which was very very good). Now it supposedly not that the coin is found on the shoulder more the body blocking, patter and movements invloved. The fact of whether it was influenced by Apollo's routine directly or not is impossible to prove either way. Although he did state originaly (and made no effort to hide, more an effort to credit) it was influenced by Gregory Wilson's Quicksilver routine, which in turn was influenced by Apollo's routine. I would also like to point out that James was at a Gregory Wilson lecture I attended and Greg was fine with James (in fact during the break James pickpocketed people so Gregory could give them back their stuff in the second half!)Greg also said he, had no problem with James's one coin routine, even the coin in eye and thought that the fact he was only using one coin and the tool of misdirection was extremely good.

In magic influence comes from everywhere. James I agree with some of your posts but I will need you to clear something up first because you keep stating that it isn't so much the coin on the shoulder more the copying movements and patter etc. With that said, you have a video up on You Tube that is basically exactly the same as Apollo's routine and patter, almost to every word in places. Now maybe you are a close friend of Apollo and he doesn't mind you doing this, in which case there obviously is no problem, but if you aren't then you are guilty of a pretty substantial case of hypocrisy. Now I want to make it clear I am not accusing you of this as I do not know the whole case or your relationship with Apollo, I am mearly pointing it out as I am interested in finding out the facts. Someone has even commented saying they can see a lot of Apollo's influence in your act. Here are just a couple of moments when you are actually using Apollos words and actions:
2.00, 2.46, 4.36, 5.06
Funnily enough it looks almost exactly the same as his clip on Mondo magic. Now I hope you are good friends with Apollo and he was in fact sitting there in the front row, as, believe me I would honestly prefer that to be correct than incorrect.

Now, I would also like to state before any posts come up saying I am James or something along those lines. I am not James Brown, however I do know James (it may come as no surprise). James has an attitude of just go out and do it, get things done. This is congruent throughout everything in his life, magic included. I think although he is not the most skilled magician alive he is still a very good one and he understands the basics of misdirection and timing EXTREMELY well. I believe it is a shame that he ever worked on the coin on shoulder idea as it has flaired up a lot of angst between magicans all over the globe over the past couple of years and started the ball rolling and spiraling into a negative swirl that no real good can come from. This is tired now and I believe it definitely was a mistake James re-releasing the coin routine. If it has been dealt with, move on, don't dig it up again.

There seems to be a lot of people on here that one know one half of one half of a story and are making false claims. Zerabubble, I'm afraid James has DEFINITELY released his working on the coin on shoulder in the past. James (Harrison) please don't take offense at what I have said as I am well aware I don't know your relationship with Apollo but I would like you to come back and tell me that you are Apollo's mate or even something like you had his permission to perform that routine at Friday Night Magic. If you didn't then your posts sort of mean nothing as you are basically doing the same as James Brown (no you haven't released a DVD but your workings are pretty clear on the video as you know you can't misdirect a camera).

I believe that this should be closed as a topic of conversation as the only two people who can legitimately have this conversation is James and Apollo.

I would like to finish by saying I thoroughly respect Apollo and his work, watching him is watching a true master and I only aspire to be up there in those ranks at some point in the future, although that is a large ambition.

Sorry if I have offended anyone, this was not my intention, it was more to try to clear up a mess of a forum post.

Ben Williams

I'm glad someone finally knows about this, for a while I thought I was the only one who knew it existed.



Again, the reason for the arguments between said parties. Especially since Apollo was being paid by the Mind Science company to explain how his routine works to a group of scientists.




Again, thank you.



That's great that Greg Wilson gave his ok to the routine, but Greg isn't the origin of the routine, he can't give permission to anyone to use it.



Heh,

That is true. I am influenced by Apollo. As I should be, seeing as though I purchased the coin on shoulder routine from Apollo's Time for a change lecture notes and The art of stealing watches booklet.






Oh, I know who you are Ben.

Yes it is tiring. But what annoys me is how people decide things based on which side of the pond we are on.




I can't agree more.




Again, thank you.



You did hit a huge nail on the head there Ben. I AM NOT selling this to the magic community as it is not mine to sell.

I have had a lot of compliments about it. (One actually from Apollo). But it isn't mine to sell.




Very true, but this would be a dead forum without gossip and rumors to run it.



This is a subject that has pickpocketing involved. Not something that comes up very often. I truly don't mind this coming up. At least this par tof the forum has something to talk about now.

But I have sharper teeth then most. =D

Back to the topic of the thread, many pickpockets have used magic in their acts. Some, like Borra and Dominque, had openers that were pure magic. Others, like Mark Raffles and Ricki Dunn, used magic as cover for picking pockets.

Hey Todd,

Paul Potassy was a magician, yet many remember him from his pickpocketing routine in his show.

David Berglas actually used pickpocketing for his mentalism. He mentions in his tome called the mind and magic of David Berglas, that he used to borrow some items on stage, use to tell some things about them (like a letter, or other papers) to make it seem he knew everything about them.

One time in his act, he exposed it. The audience laughed and from this reaction, Berglas' pickpocket act was born.

Still, the best combo of pickpocketing and magic still seems to be in Derren Brown's Absolute Magic. Truly some amazing effects inside his book.

TBH guys, I don't think this is worth the discussion.
The material really isn't workable. I don't believe James uses it in the real world at all.

James isn't on the Café-shame really, I'd have been interetsed to know HIS thoughts on this topic.

Actually,

Aside the argument between James and Apollo about the routine, I actually find a lot of his material workable in the world.

I personally enjoy his diminishing switch off Still Fancy a pot of jam,

and I really enjoy performing 'Underhanded' from his lecture video when I have a table to use.

Hi Elliott Hodges,

You said above



Your profile says you are a school student? What professional performing experience do you have to support your opinion?
I'm interested in YOUR opinion?
kind regards
Lee

Hi Lee,

I just wondered what people would say.

I was indeed a school student when I first joined the Café 4 years ago. I have had quite a bit of performing experience in pubs, churches, community centers and the like performing for laypeople.

Man.... I just got a whole education on the history of coin on a shoulder. Thank You guys lol...

Is Zerububle James Brown?

No I'm Spartacus (and so's my wife)

James was banned from this forum because Brooks is Apollos friend

Hope that helps

James Brown
(Oh *** it!)

You edit the word d@mn - seriously!!

Coin on shoulder is soooooo workable. I do it on every close-up gig and can´t remember that I ever got caught!