The Magic Cafe Forums - Taking secrets then reselling is a crime.

The Magic Cafe Forum Index :: Right or Wrong? :: Taking secrets then reselling is a crime. (0 Likes)

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kaleido-magic New user 71 Posts	Posted: Mar 15, 2007 12:44 pm 0 I personally have no problem with WE handling it. In fact I promote it, as long as the WE doesn't become the I or ME, or WE as in a small elite group of people controlling it for the rest of WE. I would go along with the whole thing, but have experienced it too many times where the we becomes the controling click at the top or even to the point of an I at the top keeping everyone they don't like out of it, including some of the most supportive, helpful, innovative, creative people. They do this only because they feel threatened. And this also "screws" the WE and reduces artforms to nothing special and helps make them lost. I now work in a place where it used to be the WE. WE all worked together and cooperated and got things done, and now it is a small clickish group of WE that controls everything, little gets done and what does get done is about as good as slapping 50 year old duck tape that has been left outside in the cold and rain the whole 50 years on a hole in your tire the size of a softball to keep it inflated as you drive 120 miles an hour to your destination 200 miles away...it just don't work. I agree complaining isn't the route, but what do you propose. I propose that it is controled by an independent organization made up of magicians whos membership is rotated and there is no way collution can occur. Which means that group may to have a group to monitor it! I don't think IBM is the group. I'm not a member, want to be, but not one at this time, and I would be left out. And how many businesses would want to cut their economic throat to keep non-members from buying something? Thanks, Brett
Jonathan Townsend Eternal Order Ossining, NY 27303 Posts	Posted: Mar 15, 2007 02:10 pm 0 Quote: On 2007-03-15 08:44, kaleido-magic wrote:...I now work in a place where it used to be the WE. WE all worked together and cooperated and got things done, and now it is a small clickish group of WE that controls everything, little gets done and what does get done is about as good as slapping 50 year old duck tape that has been left outside in the cold and rain the whole 50 years on a hole in your tire the size of a softball to keep it inflated as you drive 120 miles an hour to your destination 200 miles away...it just don't work. I agree complaining isn't the route, but what do you propose. I propose that it is controled by an independent organization made up of magicians whos membership is rotated and there is no way collution can occur. Which means that group may to have a group to monitor it!... In what appear to be some moments of cogent thought you have used some language very much like what Ayn Rand offered and published. Have you read Anthem or perhaps Atlas Shrugged? ...to all the coins I've dropped here
abc Inner circle South African in Taiwan 1081 Posts	Posted: Mar 15, 2007 03:37 pm 0 Quote: On 2007-03-08 19:05, C. Loubard wrote: Here is a sample of copyright infringement: Quote: You cannot lease something intangible such as knowledge. It has to be a very specific item. If you lease props for example you can not remake them due to copyright infringements but the knowledge contained in a book is very difficult to define in a lease, yet not impossible. here is the same thing, but reworded which is not a copyright violation. Quote: something such as knowledge can't be copyrighted... it has to be item specific. Because of copyright infringements, you can not lease props. Learning something from a book is difficult to define in a lease, but not impossible. By the way ABC, you're wrong in your wording, but almost there in your thinking. as an example, a box is protected by patents; the blueprints of the box are protected by copyright. The idea can not be protected, unless it is expressed in some tangible form (blueprint, drawing, copy), in which case it is protected by copyright. the magic community is last on the governments list to amend the law. self regulation is a better approach, but that would change the marketplace, in order to be effective. Also, if someone figures out how an effect was done and then decides to expose it, there is nothing you can do about it, regardless of changes in the marketplace. I suggest, accept the good with the bad, if you decide to pursue magic. I agree with you and you have to know that 10 am in the morning means I typed the post at night here in Taiwan after a long day so I didn't really pay attention to exact wording. People write because they make more money from selling their material than actually performing it. I would do exactly the same if only I actually had the ability to write. You should buy everything you perform for more than just the ethical reason. But you should also wash your hands more than just every time you take a leak and more than 50% of men don't even wash there hands after the go to the bathroom so "YOU SHOULD" doesn't really count.
kaleido-magic New user 71 Posts	Posted: Mar 15, 2007 06:54 pm 0 Just to be a little funny and to lighten things up here a little.... So if all the magician's were women this wouldn't be a problem and they would have clean hands!
edh Inner circle 4698 Posts	Posted: Mar 16, 2007 05:22 am 0 I would have to agree with you on that. Unfortunately, this is a male dominated society. Whether it's right or wrong, so be it. I will have to rant. Why can't a "nobody" have the same chance as a "somebody".?? No reason at all!!! There is, what I would consider, a very interesting post on another board. It kinda makes you think>>>> Magic is a vanishing art.
Jonathan Townsend Eternal Order Ossining, NY 27303 Posts	Posted: Mar 16, 2007 11:39 am 0 Asinine and sexist* statements aside, there is no "nobody", "somebody" or "chance" in that removed storybook sense some people proffer. Just YOU and YOUR ACTIONS. Opportunities are what you make of them. Since most of what we do involves interpersonal contact... perhaps a good reason to work on things like rapport skills and rhetoric. Or... perhaps just a good reason to stay in a fantasy filled with "they"? *note: check the recent published findings on female aggression (gangs, school violence) etc... ...to all the coins I've dropped here
mchristy New user Raleigh, NC area 25 Posts	Posted: Mar 16, 2007 02:45 pm 0 That was quite a tangent. I'm fairly new to magic, but it seems as though some authors/artists/whatever can, and do protect their stuff (to a degree) by simply increasing the price, and limiting availability. If it's good quality material, market demand will bring the price. This would scare away lots of casual passers by, and still keep a free market without governing authorities. I see a lot of people on here asking for recomendations for books, courses, DVD sets because they want high quality material, and are willing to pay for it.
abc Inner circle South African in Taiwan 1081 Posts	Posted: Mar 16, 2007 06:17 pm 0 And then those same people who pay premium prices are ripping the DVD's and selling them of to some guys in (wherever) who rerips them and put them on P2P's. Only got reminded of that fact by JT last night and you have no idea how big the problem is.
kaleido-magic New user 71 Posts	Posted: Mar 16, 2007 08:46 pm 0 Huge!
BlackShadow Special user London UK 665 Posts	Posted: Mar 21, 2007 02:53 am 0 Quote: On 2007-03-11 10:30, blink_inc wrote: A paid memmership to an organization.....Oh right the IBM.... This organization issues you a member card with a 16 digit number similar to a credit card. The only way to purchase magic is to be in possession of one of these cards. Create a mass data base with all these registered numbers. Websites can read from this database as authorization similar to how a credit card authorizes. Brick and mortar shops don't sell to you unless you present a membership card. Kind of like Costco or Sams Club. Membership purchasers only. I admit the idea is far fetched, but will it help solve the problem??? Will// No, because most magic dealers and creators are not interested in selling to magicians. They want to sell as many units as possible to as many people as possible. The dollars of the eager 13 year old, who wants to find out how it's done because he saw a hyped up video on Ellusionist, are just as valid as the ones from a pro who is going to nurture this effect and give it the practice it deserves. Let's face it, there are a lot more eager 13 year olds than there are experienced pros. Where do you think the market really is? People want to make a fast buck, and then they moan when stuff spreads around. They can't have it both ways. Keep the effects private, or hawk them for profit and stop whinging, but do one or the other.
C. Loubard Special user 615 Posts	Posted: Mar 21, 2007 04:51 am 0 Blackshadow... Amen to that!
Jonathan Townsend Eternal Order Ossining, NY 27303 Posts	Posted: Mar 21, 2007 11:48 am 0 Someone posted recently that you can find new magic kits by names in costo or wallmart. ...to all the coins I've dropped here
bitterman Inner circle 1189 Posts	Posted: Mar 25, 2007 07:49 pm 0 I think Wal-Mart might have a policy of expressly not stocking magic items. It is the devil's work, don't you know? If you are not cheating, you are only cheating yourself. Dutchco is about to put out some new Ebook: DUTCHCO. Get 'em while you can.