The Magic Café
Username:
Password:
[ Lost Password ]
  [ Forgot Username ]
The Magic Cafe Forum Index :: For the record :: Help with credits (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

Good to here.
Joel Givens
View Profile
New user
60 Posts

Profile of Joel Givens
Hey guys,
I'm working on a project and a lot of my books are still in boxes. I was
wondering if you could help me. I want to do this right, so if you do know
of a particular credit, it would be helpful if you had the title, author,
year of publication, and page RANGE (not just the first page) of the item in
question. Of course, I'll take any help I can get! Thanks in advance.

Kelly Bottom Placement: is there a detailed account of this move's history.
Where?

Ramsay Subtlety: We all use it and know it, but was there an original place
of publication?

Wilson Grip? I would be interested in knowing this, because it's sometimes
referred to as "Bob Fitch Grip." This is the grip where the coin is held by
the index finger.

Mike Gallo originated the backfire concept in a coins across routine...but
do you know if and when he first published it?

I also need only the year of Daryl's For Your Entertainment
Pleasure...that's a tough book to find.

Quick Three Way has a clouded history. Where did Marlo first publish it and
is the history documented anywhere?

Troy Hooser's Pendulum Cut is in his book but it was first published in the
premiere issue of Minotaur. Does anyone have the specs on that issue? (Year,
page numbers, etc.)

David Neighbors' Nest and Slide move is a great shell/utility move. Where
did he first print it?

Lin Searles' Cannibal Cards: first publication is...?

I need a credit for the old 21 force. It's a mathematical thing...but does
anyone know where it came from?

The Paul Harris idea of using tilt to show face-up and face-down cards...was
in which routine?

The HaLo cut was first printed in Rim Shots...does anyone know the year and
page range for that move? Also, I seem to recall Stephen Minch having a
footnote in one of his books tracing this move back very far. Anyone recall
this?

I know it is a lot...but any help is appreciated. I just want to make sure I
find all these sources one way or another.

Thanks,

Joel Givens
mike gallo
View Profile
Inner circle
1341 Posts

Profile of mike gallo
Joel...email or PM me...I can help you with a couple of the credits you want.

Mike
Curtis Kam
View Profile
V.I.P.
same as you, plus 3 and enough to make
3498 Posts

Profile of Curtis Kam
Joel,

Lots of questions, and Mike probably has the inside scoop on anything I get wrong here, but:

The "backfire" ending to coins across first appeared in Ross Bertram's Stars of Magic issue, pre-1951, and so pre-Mike Gallo, I'm guessing.

Lin Searles sold his original "Cannibal Cards" as a gaffed packet trick. Or a dealer sold it for him. I'd say that was the first publication.

The use of tilt to verify the Face Up / Face Down condition of the deck originally appeared in Mentzer's "Magic of Paul Harris". There were two triumph routines in that book, I think, so I can't recall the title exactly..."Joker Poker"?

Ramsay Subtlety appears in Sachs' "Sleight of Hand" in a passage I'll quote in the Buffet section here soon. The first description of Ramsay's uses would probably be the Victor Farellli write up of his "Cylinder and Coins", unless he published it in a magazine first.

The cite I usually see for the Kelly Bottom Placement is Tarbell's. I think the Orvette Master Move was published separately.

Mike has covered the history of Jimmy Wilson's Grip here on the Café before, but I'm sure he'll be able to help you here.

I'll try to dig up my copy of Daryl's book. You might find the date listed on his site, or Steven Minch's, or Magicmethods.com.

Good luck, sounds like an interesting project.
Is THAT a PALMS OF STEEL 5 Banner I see? YARRRRGH! Please visit The Magic Bakery
mike gallo
View Profile
Inner circle
1341 Posts

Profile of mike gallo
The "backfire" ending to coins across first appeared in Ross Bertram's Stars of Magic issue, pre-1951, and so pre-Mike Gallo, I'm guessing.

Curtis, this is a mere technicality...I still contend that Bertram stole it from me before I invented it... Smile !

Mike
JimMaloney
View Profile
Inner circle
1184 Posts

Profile of JimMaloney
Quote:
On 2005-08-26 22:09, Joel Givens wrote:
Quick Three Way has a clouded history. Where did Marlo first publish it and
is the history documented anywhere?


I'm not certain, but I imagine that Wesley James gives at least a partial history in his book, Enchantments.

-Jim
Books and Magazines for sale -- more than 200 items (Last updated January 17th, 2014. Link goes to public Google Doc.)
Wesley James
View Profile
V.I.P.
Hazlet, New Jersey
372 Posts

Profile of Wesley James
Joel,
Quick Three-way as we know it today is based on the original Ed Marlo routine from Ibidem #13 (12/1958), the Johnny Thompson treatment that appeared in Rusduck’s Cardiste #13 (1969), and some versions, including my own, include Harry Riser’s addition of an All-backs phase, plus elements and touches borrowed from Al Saal and Herb Zarrow (Epilogue #12, July 1971). That should sufficiently provide the background.

The (Frank) Kelly's Bottom Placement (see Tarbell) is actually just one application of Joe Ovette's "Master Move," from the manuscript by the same name.

Lin Searles "Cannibals Cards" routine was originally marketed--and may still be--by Owen Bros. (1959).

The Halo Cut is actually a reiteration of Laurie Ireland's Pull-Down Cut, albeit using a slightly different technique. I think the others who responded have covered your other questions. Good luck with your book, Joel.

Wesley James
Lee Darrow
View Profile
V.I.P.
Chicago, IL USA
3588 Posts

Profile of Lee Darrow
Paul Harris used the "Tilt Move" which is actually also known as the Vernon Illusion of Depth subtlty in a routine called "Joker Poker" in his first book, The Magic of Paul Harris.

Lee Darrow, C.H.
http://www.leedarrow.com
<BR>"Because NICE Matters!"
Magiguy
View Profile
Inner circle
Seattle, WA
5484 Posts

Profile of Magiguy
Quote:
On 2005-08-26 22:09, Joel Givens wrote:
Troy Hooser's Pendulum Cut is in his book but it was first published in the
premiere issue of Minotaur. Does anyone have the specs on that issue? (Year,
page numbers, etc.)


This was published as Troy Hooser's Pendulum False Cut in the sneak preview issue of the Minotaur (which was originally a complimentary issue to introduce the magazine). It appeared on page 3, and the issue is dated November, 1988.