I am working with my first dove. I believe he is only a couple of months old. I can do the finger ladder with him easily. he will also sit calmly when I hold him. I can't seem to get him to fly (jump) from hand to hand. Any reccomendations would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Bruce

What teaching material are you using and where are you training him? I suggest using the search tool at the top of your screen. This topic has been covered numerous times. if your still stuck I would look to the help of Bob or Dave. Good Luck
Nick

I once had a dove that naturally liked to fly from hand to hand back when I got my first couple doves when I was 10 or 11. Back then I used a dove in balloon tray and he'd fly out of the "balloon" and land on my wrist. They just seemed to like me so I didn't really have to train them. I think the key is just to handle your doves a lot so they get used to you. However, I hear a good way to train doves (if you want them to fly back to you) is to hang a sheet from the ceiling and stand in a corner.... so you form a triangle and you are at the point of the triangle.

Cris

That is great Cris I agree, if one handles their dove frequently they will like you and want to land on you hand. It is nice when you can get them young. Be careful when flying your doves make sure that the window shades are drawn and there are no mirrors they can see. They seem to think they can fly through the window glass and they seem to think mirrors are another room.

Larry,

Now I can explain the red knots on my forehead and the broken nose! LOL!

That is good advice. These also tend to have the greatest light. Light will attract the dove in flight. A good lighting tech will recognize a problem bird in a show and, in an emergency, use the lights to get him/her to come to you. It is also what makes TV studios so dangerous with dove acts. Sometimes a little thinking goes a long ways.

Scheme!

Bob
Magic By Sander

Hey Chris I didn't quite get what you mean about training the doves, could you help?
Cameron

He means that by handling them reguarly, the birds would naturally go to him. His suggested tequnique by hanging a sheet allows you to throw your doves towards the sheet. They are therefore forced in to turning back towards you. And the sheet is also soft is it shouldn't be too great a problem if on the rare occasion they bump into it (doves are prone to this)
Nick

The question of the dove not wanting to jump from hand to hand: Some birds will do it quickly, others will fly away. If this is your problem, what you might want to do is ease the dove into it more. With the dove on, say the right hand, carry him over toward the left hand and then press the left hand's finger against his chest so he perches on it. Do this a few times (it's like you're slowly taking him on the path that he will eventually hop on his own.) After he gets used to it, have him on your right hand, lightly toss towards the left hand and then drop your right hand out from under his feet. He should know where he's going now and flap over to your waiting left hand. Now you should be able to progress with the flight training steps.

Thanks to all who responded.

I currently work with the dove in an alcove in my home. We are closed in tightly on three sides and I keep the dove facing away from the open side. Occasionally he will try to take off. He does not get far however and I can pick him up right away. I try to soothe it and then get back to practice.

The sheet idea is a good one. If you only use the bare walls of the room, the chances of the bird flying into one are pretty great. The sheet or curtain will cushion the impact. You saw the curtains hanging in my basement when you picked up the bird. That is one of the reasons why they were there. Also, Larry Taylor was correct. Make sure there are no mirrors for the bird to see. For some reason they think they can do the "alice through the looking glass" effect with any mirror they see. They'll fly right into it everytime.

Dave,
You are correct. My dove does fly into walls. Not very funny, but hopefull he will learn. I will hang a sheet. Do you reccomend using black as you have done or can I use my old winnie the pooh sheets?

Bruce

P.S. are you going to magic funday?

The color doesn't matter. I have black curtains set up to create a stage atmosphere. When you hang the sheet, make sure there is enough space between the sheet and the wall to create a cushion. Flying into any hard surface can break the birds neck.

Yes, I'll be at funday. See you there.

Use Black sheets, as this simulates the lighting you'll most commonly experience from the stage! When the spotlights are on you, your dove will only see black when it comes out, except for you, when you're in the light. If possible, have four sheets hanging up, with a light in the corner. Have nothing in the room. When you produce the dove, he will have nowhere to go, but on your finger. In a room with no purches, no sticks, no furniture, throw him out with your right hand, for example, put your right hand down and lift your left hand up. It took me about two weeks to train my doves to the point where they got good at coming back to the hand. Expect a few months to perfect the technique, where they fly back to your hand 99% of the time.
Good luck!

I would agree with dearwiseone on the color except that not all dove acts are performed on a darkened stage with a spot light. The object is to get the dove to return as a natural act, not just as a trick. If you are only planning on working on a theater stage, then black is the way to go, however, for general training, a lighter curtain is just as effective. Regardless of the curtain color, removing all potential perches during training is important. Doves only see out of one eye at a time and the first thing they spot will become a perch for them. You want it to be your hand.

In case my description wasn't detailed enough.... hang a sheet from the ceiling connecting two adjacent walls. The sheet should go all the way from one wall to the other, with no gaps in between. This will form a triangle. If you stand in the corner of the two walls, you will be at the point of the triangle. And, of course, the most important point is that when you throw the dove, you should throw him out backwards with the dove facing you . . . the dove has to be facing you to fly toward you. Start with short distances and gradually increase the distance you throw him out. Don't start throwing him out farther if the dove is not coming back to you from short distances. You will also have to start experimenting with the level at which you throw your doves. For some you will have to throw them slightly down so that he will fly up to you. For other birds this will cause them to fly toward the floor. For others you will have to toss them slightly up so that he will fly down to you. For others this will cause them to fly up and perch in the rafters of the theater. The main thing is that you want to get consistency. You want your bird to come back to you 10 out of 10 times.

Cris

Crispy, I have to disagree with throwing the bird backwards. I know Shimada does it this way however, if you think of the bird before the toss, you'll realize the the feathers, especially the wings tips are now facing the opposite direction of it's travel. In other words, you're tossing the bird out against the grain. It's easy to break a wing or tail feathers that way. The purpose of the curtain is to make the dove turn around looking for a perch. I've found the best way to initially train for the toss out is to get the bird used to flying out and back without loading it. Just toss it from the hand in an arching motion at first. Then as it gets used to what you want, start tossing it straight out toward the curtain.

Dave brings up a very good point. When the bird is thrown backwards, he is fighting against the direction he's been thrown in. This puts considerable strain on the dove (this was the first method I ever tried). This also looks less elegant than a nice circle return that results from tossing a bird out in the forward direction. With the backwards toss, the audience only sees the bird move in a straight line (actually, the first thing they might see is the bird's backside!). With the forward toss, the audience will see the bird fly in a nice circle. Tony Clark has built in some nice steps for the circle-return which built incremently and allow the bird to learn little by little. There aren't any real steps inherent in the backwards toss and that might make it more difficult to learn.

Dave, I think you're right that it will be easier on the dove is it doesn't have to reverse its direction of flight. I was primarily thinking of the flyback from the Shimada/Pollack effects that involve sleeve loading. I know it's customary to load the dove backwards so the tail feathers blend in with the ruffles of the shirt sleeve.

I'll be honest, I've never used a flyback. I used to have a dove fly to my free hand after a dove from silk production. I used to also have a Chalet Doves to Rabbit and would put three of my doves in there.... the others I would have fly to a perch in the back.

Now, I'm rather lazy. I have a larger doves to rabbit that holds six doves, so I simply produce the doves, have them flutter a bit, and put them in the cage. This also works well for performing outdoors. ;-)

I'm sure there's plenty on the forum that have more experience than I with this type of thing.

Cris

Cris, I think you've got it backwards. Sleeve loading is exactly what Christopher and I are talking about. The birds should "not" be loaded backwards in the sleeve. That is what causes the potential problem. You want the dove to come out smooth, facing the audience do a turn around and come. Loading it backwards can cause harm to the birds wing or tail, has a potential of binding up and doesn't look as good to the audience.

However, this is precisley how Shimada loads his doves so they see him directly on return. (Bird goes beak in ******)

I hope I havent misread the former threads but consider the method.