Hi all,

Just watched this 2 DVD by Tamariz and they are really great. However, I was sad when I notice that some of the best effect were not explained. The theory was excellent and I am glad of my purshase. However, you know the feel when you see a really great effect without explanation...

So I am looking if any of these effect have been explained somewhere. Book or DVD.

From the lecture 1

a)Four Card Prediction
b)memory routine

From volume 2

a) Oil & Water
b) Estimation’ effect


thanks

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the four card prediction effect that he performs in the first volume can be found in his book "Mnemonica." The effect is entitled "Any Cards Called For" and is located on page 211.

I haven't seen the second volume yet, but if I had to guess, I'd say that the oil and water routine can be found in his book "The Magic Way." I'm not sure though since I haven't had a chance to read it.

Also, based on the brief description from this website:
http://www.elmwoodmagic.com/full/Magic-T......3845.htm
It's possible that the estimation effect that he performs can also be found in "Mnemonica." The trick may be "Control In Chaos" on page 116.

A)Four Card Prediction: Any Cards Called For, Mnemonica, pp. 211--214
b)memory routine: I don't think it is published in English.
c)Oil & Water: Last part have not been published yet.
d)Estimation ESP: Jumbled Divination, Mnemonica, pp. 240--242

Thanks Mushi for the clarification.

Yeah this a clever way to keep you buying more and more products. As I said many times before, if you ain't going to teach the effect don't bother showing me it. You can teach all the theory behind it as well, but I would also like to be able to do it. It is pointless to include it otherwise, and only amounts to being a marketing gimmick to keep you spending. Others may simply accept and convince themselves they got their money's worth, and try to justify it. Not me. I have enough books on theory, if I want more I will buy more.

These Tamariz lectures were given years before Mnemonica was released.

There is far more to be learnt by watching Tamariz perform than how his tricks are done.

As Harry Houdini so elequontly observed: "The great trouble with magicians is the fact that they believe when they have bought a certain trick or piece of apparatus, and know the method or procedure, that they are full-fledged mystifiers".

Its in magic way as well.

Tamariz is one of those persons who for videos don't do justice at all. I have been hearing how great and amazing he is for at least 15 years since I have been involved into card magic and I have seen all his english published videos (A1, lectures and so on) and I never really cared about him. I was just wondering what was all the fuzz about UNTIL I saw him live! He fools you so badly that there is no one else on this planet who can do that and he is excelent entertainer. Somehow this doesn't just come out on his videos, not even the spanish ones. As a friend of mine put it,

" seeing Tamariz live is like putting money into bank and you should be gladly willing to pay much more on seeing him live than on some Lucero Matrix."

Also about his lectures. Tamariz feels that we allready know enough tricks so instead of teaching us more, he talks about way more important things that tricks. He talks about drama curve of the trick, motivating sleights, standing position, rythm, keeping contact with the audience and so on. All much more important than just tricks. All the lectures should be like his instead of boring dealer/trick demos. Lecture is one of those situations where experienced performers can really shine and give out their experiences and theory in best possible way.

Oh, and pretty much all his material he demoes in his lecture is published, you just have to know where to look for.

J-M

Well I guess we no longer need explanations of effects then, we can all simply just watch performances of the masters in awe. "Boy did he fool them with that, what a master showman." In fact they can now remove ALL of the explanations out of every DVD on the market, and be able to save a ton of DVD space. We can be laymen all over again simply paying for the "performance." What you are saying is very contradictory, as other effects are "taught" on the DVD. If the DVD was simply meant to watch a performance, there would be NO explanations...period.

Great, I understand all the theory, misdirection, psychology, and subtleties of the effect. Now how about teaching the *** thing so I can do it also. Oh wait, you want me to buy another book/dvd? You think "tricks" are unimportant, I would love to see you do an act without them. Theory and application must be applied to "tricks," thus making both equally important. Trying to justify why an effect was not taught simply means you are very gullible, and susceptible to further marketing schemes. So I guess all the effects that are "taught" have no real performance value then? Please.

"God I wish I knew how you did that one Tamariz...Oh wait I mean no I don't, there is far more to be learned here than the method behind your mastery...I am in utter captivation..." OK what other book/DVD do I have to buy.......?

I understand what you're saying, but disagree with a portion of it. It can be frustrating when you're unable to learn something from one source, but have to turn to another because lack of accreditation or explanation. Yes, releasing performance-only DVDs is a little asinine; however, there were only a handful of effects not taught (that's my understanding anyway). I don't have the DVDs, so I can't say how much was taught. The buyer has found value in it though.

When I saw Juan lecture, he performed two effects, lectured for over an hour on theory, then only explained one routine, and part of the other. His explanation of one of the tricks was incredibly thorough though. He showed how every part of what he just lectured on correlated to the effect, from how to have the card selected, to turning over the revelation.

What one person could've easily explained in 5 minutes, he taught in 20. That's probably a large part of why he didn't explain everything, he didn't have the time; most of his material, because of the permeation of theory, translates significantly better through text.

Its Tamariz style to perform even an 1hour show at the beginning of his lecture and then talk about theory about hour or so and in the end perhaps explain 1 or 2 of the tricks and show how the theory he was explaining before is adopted in em.

About performance only DVD´s. I would absolutely love em! IF they werent 35$ a piece. Most explanation parts are useless to you if you have decent knowledge on magic and sadly very few dvd explanation include any nuances and presentational tips and philosophy behind the tricks. There is few but think about it, mainly explanations are just that. You do double here, elmsley here and that's it. I would prefer DVD to be used more in a ways like it was used on Tommy Wonders, Michael Closes and Max Mavens dvd´s. In Closes dvd there is small panel discussing why the thing works and why it is developed the way it is. Wonder dvds are full of theory. Maven dvd´s have commentary and other extras that make it worth much more than any tricks in whole serie.

Also, to Sirbrat (and no, that's not typo). If you really wish to add something into your repertoire, you should be willing to make some work for it, instead of just waiting it to be offered to you in gold plate. besides, if you would have bothered to read the description of Tamariz Dvd´s before buying you would have noticed that only few things is explained.

OH GOD!!!! GIVE BACK THE OLD TIMES WHEN SECRETS HAD TO BE EARNED AND THEY HAD SOME VALUE!!!!!!!!!!

J-M

You obviously have no idea who you are talking too. Quentin Reynolds, my friend.
The man that took the "hanky" into the 20th century.
James

I did not buy the DVD, and I do my "research" very intensively. I am not looking for a plate of gold, I am looking to be taught what is expected from the description. Having began magic almost 30 years ago, when I ordered from nothing more than black and white sketchy catalogs with very vague, and shady product descriptions, I think I know a little something about working for knowledge. Especially considering I had to wait 6-8 weeks without online forums to gripe in to pass time more quickly.

As already stated before, I know a DVD doesn't have to teach everything it claims to, and can still be of value. But I prefer to learn everything that is shown on these already overprices pieces of plastic, instead of continuing to buy more and more just to be taught what should have been taught in the first place. MANY DVDs do just that, and I have no complaints. I agree that the approach done in the Worker's DVDs was exceptional, and I don't think any material was left out for "theory/presentational" purposes.

This set is a standard that all sets should follow.

You obviously failed to realize what I meant by the generic term "tricks." I wasn't speaking of self-contained props, and it can be argued for years what defines being a "trick" or a piece of "art," and there will be a million different opinions. Tricks, performance art, whatever you want to call it; you get the point.

Oh yeah, I already bought my "gold plate" for $35, how many more gold plates do I need to buy?

It was the late 1980's. I was in Alan Alan's Magic Shop in London. It was fairly busy and Alan was serving the customers in his own unique style.

In walks Juan Tamariz. Having read The Five Points of Magic, I had been looking forward to seeing the man perform, and here was a chance. I introduced myself, told him how much I'd enjoyed the book, and if he wouldn't mind, I'd appreciate seeing him perform a trick. He borrowed my deck and went into an incredibly convoluted ambitious card routine that appeared to be move after move.

I didn't notice him using any of the five points mentioned in the book.

I thanked him but left disappointed. He did not live up to expectations and I put him down to a clever inventor of difficult moves.

Yet other magicians told me how good he was and how he devastated laymen. From what I'd seen, I couldn't see how.

A few years later I'm at the first Isle of Man Magic convention. Juan Tamariz is lecturing and performing.

What an incredible revelation that was. To say the man was superb would be an understatement. I was converted.

In his lecture he covered the theory behind using magic and comedy together. Coincidentally it was the exact same theory as taught to me by Eric Sharp in relation to children's shows in 1975. He also performed "The Same Trick Twice" (taught on one of the International Magic DVD's which is one heck of a presentational plot.) http://www.internationalmagic.com/acatalog/Dvds.html

Afterwards I thought back to that day in Alan's shop. Why did Tamariz perform the trick without any presentation?

Maybe he thought I was fascinated by moves.
Perhaps he didn't want to attract the attention of other customers and distarct from Alan's selling.
Maybe he didn't really want to perform and was being polite.

Anyway having read his books and seen him perform a few times, I realise the least useful thing Tamariz can teach - at least for me - is how his tricks are done.

In the early 80's, Tamariz lectured in the US. He performed the same 6 tricks at every lecture. He taught 4. At each lecture the crowd (some of them) said the same thing: "Notice how he didn't teach the best two!"

The funny thing is, Tamariz changed the tricks he chose to teach at each lecture. But always, people thought the two not taught were the best.

It's not about selling you more product. Quentin is right. There is so much more to learn from Tamariz than his tricks.

Nothing worse than someone trying to be Tamariz who is not.
Except maybe someone who just wants a secret.

Terry